Command Relay Center

[Kacen]

It seems to me looking at the Command Relay Center, and a certain cinematic screenshot, that the Command Relay Center was supposed to get modules...anyone know what happened with that? And possibly, what they would have done?

[Deathguise]

Yep, it appears the Command Relay Center was supposed to receive modules as to what they would of done ive no idea. in fact i think the PIE file(s) of the Command Relay Center with modules were liberated with the source as well some of the PIE files for the advanced research labs.

[Commander_Keyes]

Does that mean, the CRC is useless in the moment?

[Chojun]

No, you can't build/research commanders without them.

[Kacen]

Yeah, true. But other than that...it makes me wonder can we implement the modules somehow and also perhaps find another use for the command relay center? I don't always use commanders, the fact that they can't command many units until they get ranked is tedious for me. I need a large group much bigger than 6 vehicles when I send a squad out. So, because of that, sometimes I don't build a command relay center.

[Serman]

I think the limit for how many units commanders can hold should be increased to at least 10 or 12 each.

I mean, you'd need SEVERAL commanders to have a decent army behind them.

[Kacen]

Yes, I agree. Greatly. It would make them used way more often.

[Serman]

I mean, I never use commanders anymore, when I have a huge army.

It just makes every individual tank too hard to control.

[TheDaze]

I believe that the number of vehicles attached is not that much of a problem. It can increase quite fast when they engage the enemy. Furthermore, if you follow a certain sequence of steps, you can recycle an obsolete desing and manufacture a new commander which immediately gets the rank of the recycled unit. (Don't ask about the exact conditions, I myself have had trouble doing it)

I would rather say that the flaw in the design is that they have too short a sight. Their sight range is something like half the range at which they can shoot the marker. That is really, really poor. And there is no way to enhance it, by assigning it to a radar. The commant turret should have the sight of a radar or at least increase radically with versions (mark 1 to 3). The way it is now, enemy units can get right under its nose before it detects a target. Or even worse, the enemy long range vehicles (such as gauss cannons) start shooting before the commander can ever see it. Quite often the units assigned to a commander start shooting before the commander is aware of a target.

So, I suggest a longer sight range for commanders, possibly it could increase with turret make version.

[psychopompos]

-Furthermore, if you follow a certain sequence of steps, you can recycle an obsolete desing and manufacture a new commander which immediately gets the rank of the recycled unit. (Don't ask about the exact conditions, I myself have had trouble doing it)

recycled units are rebuilt in the order of recycle, cancel all manufacturing, find your highest ranked unit, send for recycle, make command turret.

-I would rather say that the flaw in the design is that they have too short a sight. Their sight range is something like half the range at which they can shoot the marker. That is really, really poor. And there is no way to enhance it, by assigning it to a radar. The commant turret should have the sight of a radar or at least increase radically with versions (mark 1 to 3). The way it is now, enemy units can get right under its nose before it detects a target.

wouldnt it be better to implement shared LOS between cmdr & its units? you could give a commander massive sight range, but then it would be pointless due to terrain(cant see through ground).
also, shared LOS would be more realistic.

Or even worse, the enemy long range vehicles (such as gauss cannons) start shooting before the commander can ever see it. Quite often the units assigned to a commander start shooting before the commander is aware of a target.

or worse still, dont shoot because the commander cant see it.

[TheDaze]

recycled units are rebuilt in the order of recycle, cancel all manufacturing, find your highest ranked unit, send for recycle, make command turret.

wouldnt it be better to implement shared LOS between cmdr & its units? you could give a commander massive sight range, but then it would be pointless due to terrain(cant see through ground).
also, shared LOS would be more realistic.
or worse still, dont shoot because the commander cant see it.

Thank you, that would very likely have to be the correct recycling sequence.

As for the LOS. A shared one would have its interesting effects, but it would be much more difficult to implement. Good idea, nonetheless. But I don't see how the terrain imperviousness could be a problem if we simply increased sight range, it just adds to realism. 

I would look for a quickie, one that could be implemented in the simplest possible way, assuming there is a parameter that defines sight range that can be readily changed, as a step one. Just to see how it affects the battlefield. As a step two, have the range to depend on turret make. And then, step three, enter shared LOS, voila! ;D What thinks you?

[EvilGuru]

recycled units are rebuilt in the order of recycle

Incorrect, it is in rank order. So the highest ranked unit currently in the pool will be recycled.

All of your balance points are very valid, so I definitely suggest you take a look at some of my previous posts on the topic and tell me what you think

Regards, Freddie.

[TheDaze]

All of your balance points are very valid, so I definitely suggest you take a look at some of my previous posts on the topic and tell me what you think

I am not sure which points do you mean. Also, I went through your posts (too many interesting topics ), but the closest to our topic are about recycling and assigning factories. About assigning to factories, yes, a valid point, but not sure how you want to go about it. About recycling, well, I believe in simple solutions. In my opinion, ranking is not that important (unless you make it so by massively tweaking hit points). Certainly not when both sides are subject to same rules and locked into stalemate on the battlefield. Which means lots of losses an a vast majority of rookie units. If one side overpowers the other quickly though, there is not much opportunity to get rank on one hand, and on the other, the futility of ranking the units of the side that is winning anyway should be quite obvious.

[RBL-4NiK8r]

Well for the most part Commanders were useless do to the fact they die to easy, yes that could be fixed, but when you kill one all units that were hooked to that Commander become useless and basicly sit there till you go round them back up.

Now they were nice for targeting long range fixed a mobile artty that you had, or use them for CB fire, hell I recall one game where I took out all enemy CB towers with them and then let my artty go to town. In the SP game they were a nice thing to have at times, but once you learn most of the hot key commands you can do just as good without them, and in MP games they are just basicly cannon fodder. Also in MP games they dont last long enough to get high enough rank to make them worth usings.


4nE

[Deus Siddis]

I think the main things that needs to be fixed with commanders also needs to be fixed with forward observers and these really need to be fixed before any balancing or additional features for commanders can be added. They be:

1) Assigning combat and artillery vehicles to them should not be necessary for those underling vehicles to benefit from them. If you drive a sensor-turreted forward observer into sight range of an enemy that is within firing range of stationary artillery emplacements (but beyond their natural sight range) they will fire on it even though you did not (and I think in fact cannot) assign them to that observer. Why shouldn't mobile artillery be able to use this same simple system? And why shouldn't commanders do this as well, automatically increase the effectiveness of fighting units within their range without them being assigned to that particular commander?

2) You need to be able to command underling units separately, just as you normally can, even though they are assigned to a commander or observer. Otherwise you have units marching into enemy fire, traffic jams, just ridiculous chaos that is totally unnecessary because you are not allowed to manage any of it.

Until these are fixed, mobile artillery will be assigned to forward observers only because the game forces you to for them to be useful as artillery at all and commanders will continue to go unused because they are pointlessly and massively detrimental to commanding (oh, such bitter irony) your forces effectively.

This was one of only two real problems I had with WZ back in the day, if it could be fixed that would make the game much more intuitive and fun, as well as eliminating all of those "#$*&%!" moments where you can do nothing to stop your artillery column as it takes a shortcut into a tank battalion while trying to keep up with their forward observer.