super unit

[Wisler456]

hi this idea is completly random, but i was thinking alot of games i play on high oil maps sometimes end in both teams having invulnerable bases ( 2 layers of missle forts and 671736172630 SAM sites ) and it often comes down to who has the most angels, and then sensor push. At this point in the game all units seem pretty much obselete.

What i think would be cool would be somekind of super unit you were ablt to get nearer the end of the game to makes units useful again. Mabye somekind of flying heavy cyborgs. Like mabye say a borg that can carry a weapon in either arm and has vtol propulsion and super high armour and speed, by this i mean it can walk about and fly about , obviously we shudnt be allowed these till 1 hour+ into the game when the super bases are up, but i think it would make some otherwise art war games alot more fun.

Or mabye make units even more customizable, say give the option to add extra layers of armour to them at say 300 power extra layer, or fine tune there engines. Im sure people get the point of this post though (we need more uber units at end game). Some may say "hm armoured units with good engine, thats dragon/hydra" but lets be honest dragon looks cool but it fully sucks, by the time it gets in range of a missle fort it died 15 years ago.

Feel free to mock me.

Wisler.

[Olrox]

hi this idea is completly random, but i was thinking alot of games i play on high oil maps sometimes end in both teams having invulnerable bases ( 2 layers of missle forts and 671736172630 SAM sites ) and it often comes down to who has the most angels, and then sensor push. At this point in the game all units seem pretty much obselete.

It's a risk you take when you go playing high oil maps and don't take serious measures to crush your enemy before he can turtle so chicken-heartedly. Anyway, there's a Limits Mod that allows limiting fortresses, made by KukY (I didn't test it, but it's here) That should help avoiding those situations.

But I don't like the idea of super units. What about using LasSat to break a hole through the defenses and rush with dragon hovers?

Anyway, I still support the idea that playing with a turtler in high-oil maps brings that sort of danger, you can be sure.

Feel free to mock me.

It's dangerous to say that, there are people who will seriously take on that invitation.

~Olrox

[Zarel]

[INSERT MOCKING HERE]

[Dylan Hsu]

Yeah that's why NTW style maps suck. Look at my sig for your remedy.

[Olrox]

[INSERT MOCKING HERE]

let's add a new code!
[mock]<name>[/mock] xD

anyway

As I mentioned before, maps with too much oil turn those problems you've mentioned awfully possible. But another major problem is lack of intense enough gameplay. If you don't cease attacking and harassing your enemy's bases and derricks, it's much easier for him to turtle.

If we have a "super unit", he'll just produce a ton o' these and leave crowds of them inside his base, making the situation even worse.

Again - this mutual turtle cannot happen if the map is good enough and the players aren't in a stubbornness contest. Either of those can be easily corrected.

~Olrox

[Brisingr]

well i think super units are a good idea if done correctly, for example

use a limiter for these units (classed as structures but are units to maybe trick the coding perhaps)

or maybe have a third dragon like body thats huge and only can have fort turrets and needs all research complete to be able to get it.

Maybe have super units land based only so they cant fly or cross the sea also they would be the slowest unit and it could have weak points that your units can target to destroy them faster like using vtols to attack points on top and land units to attack the sides and underbelly (if its a walker unit)

Really all it needs is a bit of thinking and it will be possible and still keep balance

PS:you mock me you will burn muhahaha... jk

[Mats]

Warzone isn't made or balanced for playing maps that have loads of oil in base so issues will always occur on these maps and there's (it seems) no fix for it that would leave the standard game (i.e. having ~4 oil in base with the rest scattered over the map) balanced.

[Zarel]

use a limiter for these units (classed as structures but are units to maybe trick the coding perhaps)

We don't need to "trick" the coding when we have the source code, you know.

Classifying a unit as a structure will make it immobile, take up terrain space, be unmanufacturable by factories, etc etc...

or maybe have a third dragon like body thats huge and only can have fort turrets and needs all research complete to be able to get it.

No one's going to get all research completed; that would just be mean to give a technology no one could ever have.

Maybe have super units land based only so they cant fly or cross the sea also they would be the slowest unit and it could have weak points that your units can target to destroy them faster like using vtols to attack points on top and land units to attack the sides and underbelly (if its a walker unit)

Would be an interesting idea.

Really all it needs is a bit of thinking and it will be possible and still keep balance

Balancing isn't as easy as you think.

[Olrox]

Really all it needs is a bit of thinking and it will be possible and still keep balance

Balancing isn't as easy as you think.

Balancing even what we have right now is already complicated, adding completely new things like huge super-units would take much testing time and would generate more than a few dozens of pages in discussion topics.

Up to get to work yourself? It's only "a bit of thinking", you said

~Olrox

[charonme]

what about more kinds of superweapons (like the laser satellite)? One user would be able to build only one of them.

Or perhaps some unit teleportation like in red alert 2?

[Brisingr]

xD hey i would make these things if i had the skills in scripting and if it isnt that good for everyone it could be put into a mod.

I will attept to make the models in the current 3D program thats been used if you give me a link to the download for it i will just need someone to be bothered to try scripting and hey if it dont work out now it can always be an idea for future warzone's or even a idea for those trying to make a sequel to warzone 2100.

really i would give this a bash and sorry for taking a little while to respond, college giving a lot of work lately and sorry for any spellings.

[Assault Gunner]

Maybe if these were skirmish units it could be balanced. Maybe. After all, no one cares as long as whooping the computer isn't *too* easy. And if you find it too easy, well, thats what the difficulty sliders are for.

[bornemix]

I haven't played this game much, but couldn't a deadlock in an oil-rich map theoretically be won if one takes over the others oil derricks, one by one?

[Assault Gunner]

Umm... All the turrets, fortresses, etc. make it impossible for you to do that. double, or even triple, layers of missile/gauss turrets and lots of AA are impassable, resulting in max armies required to takedown 1-2 fortresses, due to overlap.

[Olrox]

There is only a real solution to maps with more than 10 oil within each players' bases:

Delete them.

With flaME, anyone can do a map. if you aren't skilled at making topography, you can always use "greenfish map generator" (Rman mentioned this one in his "4c-Aqua Co-op" topic) to generate random reliefs - you just have to set the right height colors and use the images to import as a heightmap in flaME. Everything else is more about good sense than skill, IMO - anyone can make a good map, but it does take talent to make a whole scenario, with special possibilities and innovative dimensions to it.

~Olrox