Project is a mess

[Terk]

Seriously, what are you guys doing to this once great game?

1.1 was pretty playable and workable, I did have a few crashes here and there, but nothing like what is going on now.

Then you guys made 2.0, got into linux sh*t, then the crashes started to roll in, and the horrible artifacts started from the switch from microsoft directx to opengl. Sound was worse, from directplay to openal, chokes on big battles, font looked like original (YA!).
2.0.1 - 2.0.10 still crash prone compared to 1.1, no fixes for artifacts, ever think of switching back to directx? Sounds is still crap, should have switch to directplay again! Net battles suck!
2.1 New font sucks! (BOO!) Sound engine sill sucks, crackling and hissing on big battles. Net battles still suck!
2.1.3 was better than 2.1, but not by much. Still had bad case of artifacts. Font still sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!
2.2.0 was a slight improvement over 2.1, but a bit worse than 2.1.3, and still had bad case of artifacts. Font still sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!
2.2.1 finally fixed the artifacts, only took more than a freaking year! But wait, we now get more crashes instead of artifacts. Font sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!

Is there no quality control anymore or what? Looks like everyone is doing whatever they want, and be dammed with the shape of the game.
Was there a internal fight between windows developers, and the linux ones, and all the windows ones split? Can't say I blame them!
Was the change from windows the root cause? If so, screw them! Bring it back to windows only, it will be more stable than the trash opensource sh*t you guys use now instead of the original microsoft directx and directplay!
Who is in control of the project, pushing out rubbish releases? There should be no releases until your certain it does not crash , and be more like 1.1!
Thanks for including a AUTHORS file, it shows people who to avoid. I bet pumpkin is shocked at the sorry state the game is in!

[G0rz]

Hello Terk,

So what your getting at is, you think Warzone isn't a good game anymore because it is being expanded? Well now, you are a confused one. I'm going to pick your post apart in sections to make it easier to read for you.

Then you guys made 2.0, got into linux sh*t, then the crashes started to roll in, and the horrible artifacts started from the switch from microsoft directx to opengl. Sound was worse, from directplay to openal, chokes on big battles, font looked like original (YA!)

Hm, well now, I don't see how linux is "sh*t" it is a very popular operating system that people such as you can't navigate around because your afraid of change.
Also, the reason that the game became more prone to crash is because of game engine upgrades. If you want the same old warzone, I'm sure amazon or ebay has a few of the discs for sale.

2.1 New font sucks! (BOO!) Sound engine sill sucks, crackling and hissing on big battles. Net battles still suck!

The fact the font "sucks" is a matter of opinion. I personally didn't notice a big enough sound quality loss to say it sucks, and as this is hosted on servers that you don't have to pay for... I suggest you don't complain about net battle quality.

is there no quality control anymore or what? Looks like everyone is doing whatever they want, and be dammed with the shape of the game.

Welcome to the open source world mate.

Was there a internal fight between windows developers, and the linux ones, and all the windows ones split? Can't say I blame them!

Just because linux is involved with warzone doesn't mean it is the problem.

Was the change from windows the root cause? If so, screw them! Bring it back to windows only, it will be more stable than the trash opensource sh*t you guys use now instead of the original microsoft directx and directplay!

I am really happy that I can play Warzone on other systems. I can now not only play on my Windows computer, but also my mac and linux box's as well! and as a matter of fact, pumpkin released the source code, thus making it open source, so you can blame them for that.
Again, if you have a problem with where the Warzone resurrection team is going, no one is stopping you from buying the original game discs from said online sites.

Who is in control of the project, pushing out rubbish releases? There should be no releases until your certain it does not crash , and be more like 1.1!

As far as I know, it is a team decision when to release the latest release. Notice how I say release? That means, it isn't perfect, there will be bugs and crash's, this is to tide you over, and also to find bugs that the dev's may have missed while debugging.

Thanks for including a AUTHORS file, it shows people who to avoid.

I'm surprised such a small team is maintaining the game. The fact the do regular releases and such good upgrades to the engine, amazes me. If anything I would hire and one of these fine people if I owned a game development company. Keep up the good work guys!

I bet pumpkin is shocked at the sorry state the game is in!

Far from it, pumpkin wanted its game to live on past its supported years... They wanted to see what people would do with the game, which is why they released the source code.

I know I'm probably going to get flamed for this message, but that is how I feel on this subject. The team accept Constructive criticism, not flat out insults.

Again, keep up the great work WZRP!

Cheers,
G0rz

[Tiberian]

how about no

[Zarel]

Meh. I won't be defensive or anything, I'll just be honest:

1.1 was pretty playable and workable, I did have a few crashes here and there, but nothing like what is going on now.

You have an incorrect memory of what 1.10 was like. It was a lot more unstable than you'd think.

Then you guys made 2.0, got into linux sh*t, then the crashes started to roll in, and the horrible artifacts started from the switch from microsoft directx to opengl. Sound was worse, from directplay to openal, chokes on big battles, font looked like original (YA!).

Erm... the game currently looks nicer in OpenGL than it ever did in DirectX. Warzone used to be really grainy, and it's a lot better these days.

Sounds are worse, I agree, but there's nothing I can do about that. :/

2.0.1 - 2.0.10 still crash prone compared to 1.1, no fixes for artifacts, ever think of switching back to directx? Sounds is still crap, should have switch to directplay again! Net battles suck!

While I'd agree that I'd prefer DirectX support in addition to OpenGL support, it's infeasible, since none of the developers have the skills and/or time necessary to maintain a DirectX rendering engine.

2.1 New font sucks! (BOO!) Sound engine sill sucks, crackling and hissing on big battles. Net battles still suck!
2.1.3 was better than 2.1, but not by much. Still had bad case of artifacts. Font still sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!

What was your issue with net battles?

I agree that the 2.1 font was pretty bad, but it was fixed for 2.2.

2.2.0 was a slight improvement over 2.1, but a bit worse than 2.1.3, and still had bad case of artifacts. Font still sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!
2.2.1 finally fixed the artifacts, only took more than a freaking year! But wait, we now get more crashes instead of artifacts. Font sucks! Sound still sucks! Net battles still suck!

I and the other developers fixed most of the crashes in 2.2.1; I believe you'll find that 2.2.2 is a lot more stable.

Is there no quality control anymore or what? Looks like everyone is doing whatever they want, and be dammed with the shape of the game.

No comment on the others, but pretty much all I've been doing is fixing bad balance introduced in 2.1, improving the unit AI, improving the graphics, making the game easier to use, and fixing bugs.

Was there a internal fight between windows developers, and the linux ones, and all the windows ones split? Can't say I blame them!

There's never been a real fight.

The main problem was, and has always been, that most good developers use Linux. So as the project went on, there were more Linux developers than Windows developers, so Windows-specific engines like DirectX simply couldn't be maintained.

Right now, Buginator and I are the only Windows developers. He's the only one that uses Visual Studio. (I just use Notepad and GCC on the command line.) I don't know anything about DirectX, and as far as I know he doesn't either.

Was the change from windows the root cause? If so, screw them! Bring it back to windows only, it will be more stable than the trash opensource sh*t you guys use now instead of the original microsoft directx and directplay!

Doubtful. The lack of developers is really the root cause. Most of our developers simply don't have that much free time. And none of our developers are good at Windows-only stuff like DirectX, so that would only make it worse.

Personally, I'd like to see more Windows-focused development, the return of DirectX, and the ability to compile Windows installers using Visual Studio (or at least the MSVC compiler) again. Sadly, we just don't have developers with that kind of expertise these days. The ones who did just don't have enough free time.

Who is in control of the project, pushing out rubbish releases? There should be no releases until your certain it does not crash , and be more like 1.1!

No one, as far as I know. It's a team thing.

Personally, I argued against releasing 2.2 so early because I knew it was relatively unstable, but I was overruled. In any case, waiting until we're certain it doesn't crash is far too long... all software has some number of bugs (Google, say, "Microsoft Word crash" if you want to see proof ).

Thanks for including a AUTHORS file, it shows people who to avoid. I bet pumpkin is shocked at the sorry state the game is in!

Actually, most people are a lot more optimistic about the project. Many Pumpkin employees say they love how we've improved the game.

You're also discounting the numerous improvements that have been made so far. The support for many other languages. The ability to zoom a lot more. The support for screen resolutions higher than 800x600. The ability to switch the mouse buttons to be more like modern RTSes. The less grainy graphics. The better multiplayer balance. The better Repair Facility AI.

[Per]

Seriously, what are you guys doing to this once great game?

We are wrecking it just to spite you.

If you think we're not doing enough to please you, there is nothing stopping you from trying to do a better job.

[BulletMagnet]

/thread.

[new paradigm leader]

such a troll he fails does this mr. terk.
two things on this windows development does continue (training on txt editing atm have modded it so scav infantry is designable and usable )

[psychopompos]

*insert lyrics for never gonna give you up here*
...

[new paradigm leader]

ah forums.Wz2100.net Anonymous haven for over 9000 webdays
did everyone remember caturday?

[new paradigm leader]

no this is NOT troll thread

[astorian]

Dear Terk,
I am not going to quote your post since others already answered to it with full extend.
Ewen so there is one thing i would like to tell you from my side:
If you are not satisfied with the work of others they do - without requesting any compensation and share it with others, so others can use it/ change it/ contribute to it ....
If you are not a programmer or 3D artist or you don't have other skill related to the WZ development that would allow you to study the hard work of others put into something for what is no compensation ...
If your only way of expression is not to create constructive critics, but just angry released denial....
well i have to tell you: go frack your self.

Sincerely,
Astorian

[cybersphinx]

Is there no quality control anymore or what?

This is an open source project, nobody here is paid to do anything. There is as much quality control as people are willing to do for the unreleased code. If you want better quality in releases, then test the game before it is released - it is availably publicly in SVN, you know.

[EvilGuru]

Thanks for including a AUTHORS file, it shows people who to avoid.

Outstanding! I spend a reasonable portion of my day attempting to avoids morons — such as yourself. Hence I support you in your initiative to avoid me. Bravo.

But, you know what they say: "In Soviet Russia, moron avoid you!"

Polemically yours, Freddie.

[BlueMaxima]

Trust me, the first think I'm tempted to say is full of ****, ****, ****, ****-****...goes on.

Second thing: If you don't like it, you can go jump off something incredibly tall. We all have bandwith to pay for, and your few kilobytes of text telling the devs they're doing a bad job is just wasted space on the internet.

Third thing: I envy the devs a lot. They can take a highly-unstable game like 2100, modify it to work in today's environments, and actually add new stuff on top of that. If I had that sort of skill, I'd be rich by now, and I'm sure other people would be too.

Fourth thing: Ever heard of Fallout 3? When Bethesda bought it, people thought they were gonna send the canon straight down the hole, and make a horrible game that wouldn't be Fallout at all. While the canon was raped to near-non-Fallout, a game - a beautifully fun game was made out of it. Some people still hated what Bethesda had done, but many of those people, I brand as bored dumbasses who don't have anything better to do but insult the hard work of 200+ people. So when a few people take a game, improve it and add new stuff to it, in their own free time, and you call it crap? Catch my drift here?

Fifth thing: The amount of time and brains you used to type up your post on this forum could have been used to do something that would be much more fulfilling. Getting a girlfriend. Reading a book. Finding a hobby. Putting your right hand to good use. Do something, other than tell these people they suck (or their product). You need to get a damn life.

[Kamaze]

Come on guys, keep going to amuse me!