[COMPLETED - Thank you] Campaign 4 Mission 8 Balance Testing

[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Ok folks, the time is approaching for the general community to get their hands on Campaign 4 stuff.

Milo & Flail are hard at work scripting Missions 1-7 so I'm not going to add to their workload with something that I think the community would enjoy being involved in. And this is your chance to be one of the first people to see it.

So here's the first offering: Mission 8 - "Return to Arizona". It's unscripted, for starters. None of the mission stuff is in place yet. This map is (partially) THE prototype Campaign 1 map that the Pumpkins made when they began Warzone development. I've fixed it up, updated what needed to be updated, reintegrated the final Campaign 1 map, reintegrated some of the things from the prototype, tweaked it some more, and then set down a place for NEXUS to hang his hat ... if he wore them.

In short, this is a show of appreciation, and a tribute to Warzone 2100 and to Pumpkin Studios for their ingenuity all those years ago.

What I'm looking for, specifically, is whether to AI is too STRONG here. My gameplay style is not the same as everyone else's, and I really want some different points of view on how this map plays out. My skills at gameplay are lackluster so what may seem strong to me might be "just right" for others. I'd like to make sure.

So here's what I need to know:

- Is the AI too strong?
- Is the AI too vulnerable? (it could happen...)
- Does it take too long to play the map? (Target time is 3 hours).
- Anything that can be done differently?
- Any problems with pathing or tiles?

Instructions for testing:

- Use single-player skirmish mode.
- AI is player 3. In the options, turn off players 1 and 2. So while it's a 4-player map, the mission will be three player (and no, I'm not going to say why, yet. ).
- Start with full bases, T1.
- Do what you need to win. I'll warn you ahead of time, NEXUS is VERY stiff here, by design. He's had two years to dig in.

Please submit all feedback in this forum, and not the Campaign 4 Development thread. Enjoy!

[EDIT: Forgot something]

4c-Cam4-8Testing.wz

(60kb)

[Terminator]

challenge mode will suits better for map like this.

[Goth Zagog-Thou]

This isn't a challenge. It's Mission 8 of the new Campaign, and it's for testing purposes.

[Rman Virgil]

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Stiff... to be sure.

Defenses are formidable all around.... especially stiff are AA from jump.

Within 15 minutes, 145 ground units are storming the players position.

My first impression is that it may be altogether too formidable. But I need to test more for sure to explore ALL Player opportunities that exist within the current configuration & dynamics.

'Course, creating an island fall back position for the player to retrench could make for another interesting dimension and, at the same time, shift the balance more equitably. That's just an intuition.

There are tile textures here and there that don't blend smoothly. Minor really, as I'm sure you will see them.

PF & PW seem fine so far.

- RV
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[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Yep, that's something I had to live with. It's almost like the Pumpkins reduced the number of tiles in the Arizona set. To be fair, it looks REALLY awesome in Trunk.

I set up the first leg of the map with a specific goal in mind.. and no, not a lesson in frustration. I want the player to get the tech up to a certain level (Ripples, Arties and VTOL) in order to proceed. The trick to that first leg is closing off the choke point where the peninsula starts at, AT the spot that lone oil deposit is. 12 mortars and a line of Heavy Machinegun & Flamers in front will fix NEXUS's little red wagon.. and that's all the hintage I'll give for now. But trust me when I say that there's specific goals I had in mind for this map, and nothing is there without a reason.

[Rman Virgil]

Yep, that's something I had to live with. It's almost like the Pumpkins reduced the number of tiles in the Arizona set. To be fair, it looks REALLY awesome in Trunk.

Yea, on both counts.

I set up the first leg of the map with a specific goal in mind.. and no, not a lesson in frustration. I want the player to get the tech up to a certain level (Ripples, Arties and VTOL) in order to proceed. The trick to that first leg is closing off the choke point where the peninsula starts at, AT the spot that lone oil deposit is. 12 mortars and a line of Heavy Machinegun & Flamers in front will fix NEXUS's little red wagon.. and that's all the hintage I'll give for now. But trust me when I say that there's specific goals I had in mind for this map, and nothing is there without a reason.

Which A.I. are you using btw ?

I surmised as much your intentions by what you chose to place and where..

My only early reservation is that the A.I. I'm using can tech-up a lot quicker than I can, has the right templates and can invalidate the ground choke by using hover and an air force and will also be building arty sooner than me. But we'll see as I test further.

- RV
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[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Believe it or not, it's stock 1.10. I shudder to think what NTW or DyDo is like...

In fact, I'll go test that now.

[lav_coyote25]

Believe it or not, it's stock 1.10. I shudder to think what NTW or DyDo is like...

In fact, I'll go test that now.

nasty azzed miserable rotten stupid orunning bast@rds....
i took one of each of the different ai... BIG mistake. holy crap!!!

[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Hehe... it's meant to be used with player 0 and player 3. There's a reason Player 1 is there, but that's for the mission and it's location is a placeholder for now, but not in that spot.

DyDo is doing some kind of un-kosher stuff. My machine lags terribly using DyDo. No other AI causes it, so I dunno. But DyDo sure is nasty on that map. Oh, and I'm convinced DyDo cheats.

[lav_coyote25]

Hehe... it's meant to be used with player 0 and player 3. There's a reason Player 1 is there, but that's for the mission and it's location is a placeholder for now, but not in that spot.

DyDo is doing some kind of un-kosher stuff. My machine lags terribly using DyDo. No other AI causes it, so I dunno. But DyDo sure is nasty on that map. Oh, and I'm convinced DyDo cheats.

and your first clue being???? yes - i just did dydo... i am going to have to look at that map... maybe do it a bit bigger... if you dont mind...

[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Yeah, I could probably add some stuff to the south.. that's all the space there is to use.

[Rman Virgil]

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I started with DyDo. It does cheat and does out tech where it counts in the areas as mentioned. No 3 hours here. Not by a long shot. I'll see about Semper Fi. I don't do NTW.

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[Goth Zagog-Thou]

3 hours was just a rough guesstimate. It's mainly so I get get an idea what a decent mission timer would be for this one. I figured that we'd start at 3 and work it downwards from there. Testing at it's finest.

[Rman Virgil]

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I c. Makes sense.

The various SKI a.i.s are dynamic & different from each other - each presenting many variables introduced depending on the difficulty settings (the pre-placements being the common denominator).

Probably best to get as many peeps feedback as possible with their particular a.i.s used & difficulty set-ups mentioned.

Besides the Timer scripting what all else is being set in motion by CAM specific scripting ?

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[Goth Zagog-Thou]

Besides the Timer scripting what all else is being set in motion by CAM specific scripting ?

Objectives (little red flashing dot on the minimap) and victory/loss conditions. You can also script the AI to do specific things at specific times, play voice clips, etc.