Massive Conquer the World (Or almost) Campaign

[Lancefighter]

why? if it works, run with it. Who cares how he wins, just that he wins?

I see no reason to lock anything. Make it hard to do, sure, but dont arbitrarily FORCE anyone to do anything. I hate forcing people to do things.

[Assault Gunner]

Point taken. I think the tutorials should be locked in, however, with a "Skip tutorial" option included.

[Lancefighter]

That will work :p

[DTSX]

Ah, like where this is going... At least it's clear that we want a non-linear game.

As cliché as it is, the "final boss" would be something of a monstrosity. Like a whole, "congrats, you killed the boss... OR DID YOU?" and shazam, super boss comes out of nowhere and wrecks havoc.

As for tutorials, rather than doing what most games do in the beginning, I'd prefer if there is any storyline, for it to be made clear during the tutorial.

My idea was that the first mission is one giant tutorial of sorts. Second would be allowing the player to get their feet wet a bit, then toss em into the fray.

First mission would be the player controlling Scavs vs. other scavs (learning how to move the mouse and stuff), then eventually, the player finds a tech and an abandoned research facility. The player is allowed to get "truck" tech, thus starting the whole tech tree from the start. After that, within the same mission, the player gets schematics for things like factories, HQ, etc. That way, the player feels like he's playing a story and learning at the same time.

[Assault Gunner]

That actually sounds nice... the original mission 1 just became mission 2.

[Lancefighter]

would be kinda funny to see a truck on top of a schoolbus :p
but other than that its a cool idea, except perhaps that scavs have very low armor and hp (its not fun to lose units a lot, even if they are cheap)
Although could probably set it up in such a way that you start building viper/wheel/mg before you can build trucks (you find the blueprint for the viper/wheel/mg, and since you dont have a command station, you cant design units)

As for 'big boss', im not actually much of a fan of single units that are hard to kill.. However a well built base with defensive artillery and one or two weaknesses set there for you to exploit is probably good.

thats actually a really cool idea >.>

[DTSX]

How about a "boss" base and inside it? An even bigger boss unit. Just a massive series of headaches.

Imagine, you THINK the game's over, then you get a notice, "Warning - Space-Time Continuum Disruption detected" then the map increases slightly, letting you see a wall, then it gets bigger, and bigger until you realize the enemy's base is actually 1/2 the entire map... made up of 7 computers. I think I'd successfully crap my pants if I saw that.

[Lancefighter]

as long as its just a base constructing units.. :p
A few of the supcom maps are like that - you level a hostile base, just to find out there is one not 2km north of it that is twice the size.
Of course, most of the campaign in supcom seemed incredibly easy, so its not really comparable..

its just that in my rts i like to enjoy a game where the player is neither far behind nor far ahead of his opponent - warzone maintains this balance well (albeit by forcing you to stop researching) and in such a way that you dont feel stifled by the inability to create greater units.
Like say, in dow:dc, if you put the difficulty on normal, your units all have 2x the base hp. Of course, your enemy is also frequently two AI's. (on hard, you get base hp, enemy still has 2 AIs. Pain in the ass I will tell you. On easy.. well.. I never actually tried easy.) I disliked the fact that my units were any different than they should be, as well as the fact that they had two AI's. It made no sense to be, and felt like a very artificial challenge - like a deliberately cheating AI because the devs are too lazy to code a difficult AI.

All of this rambling basically means..
I want it balanced. A player should feel pressure the entire game, and if he plays his cards right in the setup, he might buy himself a moment or two of respite somewhere along the line. /never/ should a player feel relaxed, comfortable, or in control. These are things you want to avoid, because it means its too easy. When the end finally comes, after all of that is the incredible win the player worked to get..

the summery of the summery - Dont give the AI anything the player wont have soon (and vice versa)

[DTSX]

How about a whole time limit where the player has to destroy something before the timer runs out or the laser satellite will rain destruction on his army. The point is that no matter what, you won't be able to take your sweet little time killing everything around. Eventually, it should turn into a massive suicide rush for the building. Then the base is out of commission, and you're like " FINALLY!" and then *Slap in the Face* A HUGE base.

[Assault Gunner]

@Lancefighter: It's quite hard to do that when the player can choose his own path through the game... I mean, some players might choose to go the path where they get arty techs ASAP, some may choose rocket tech, some cannon tech, etc. etc.

[DTSX]

Basically, it's not so much as giving the computer something you don't have, it just happens that the computer has a different set of techs that it got from conquest.

Initially, you'll be fighting against the Scavs for control of the area, while the other teams also battle for conquest of the world. Basically, the key here is, hit them fast, hit them hard, cause you'll be feeling it later on. If we can't code that in, then we should give the computers restrictions every turn so that they can and will hit a certain tech. If you're too slow at fighting in general or taking positions/digging in, then you're going to be hit by a hammer.

[Lancefighter]

mm yeah, thats what i get for posting that late at night. Basically, it will be very difficult to do right

[Assault Gunner]

Ah, well. I'll write the script for each area once we decide on what they are.

[DTSX]

The thing I'm currently worried about is that if you successfully attack a province, then the enemy takes it back, what would you be attacking/what are the objectives the second time around?

[Lancefighter]

eh at that point it might be 'mere' territorial control, or possible something else. I was hoping it could be done in such a way that each province has some semi-unique reward.. For instance, some provinces could let you start with buildings on the attack, or start with extra oil, or make all your new units start at rank 2? (possible more of that could be incorporated, these are just ideas) While you only gain the tech the first time around, the other reward is useful whenever you own that province.

Some of them might be a satellite uplink, to let you see the whole map (and maybe even laser-sat, although im not sure how you could attack without selecting a building?