hey guys!

[Lancefighter]

So uh, long time lurker and wz2100 player here.

been keeping track of this forum for the last few weeks at least (visited earlier last year as well..)

Ive never quite finished the campaign currently around the middle of beta.. Those damn ripple rockets are annoying, along with lancer/tank killer vtols, and I generally play a fairly conservative game - I wont walk into artillery without recon, but I hate just looking at the guide for recon info.
Now that I have vtols, it makes it easier.. but well, 3+ minute timers on the reinforcements makes it horrible to lose vtols for no good reason... Anyway, I digress.


Generally, after a bit of messing around, I figured out it was pretty easy to beat the AI (even dydo..) in 1v1 scenarios or 3v3 (two dydo on my team), although I have a few questions about my general strategy.

First, is there any reason to use anything other than machineguns? Early game, heavy machineguns are kinda more useful than most any gun I can find - AP guns seem to be more 'all rounder' in the beginning than 'all rounder' guns, especially when the AI uses cyborgs a good deal.
Now, midish game, the only weapon I can see using is the assault gun - Hypervelocity cannons seem a fair bit lame, and assault cannons seem fairly useless as well, compared to assault guns. I must say, I never actually had a game last farther than dual assault guns. (they make fantastic AA as well........ perhaps too good?)

Usually, however, this means most of my game revolves around getting 5 research up and generally turtling until I get to assault guns, then rolling over the AI with dual assault gun heavy body tracks..
MG research also yields the best AA guns, so its usually fairly easy to protect against vtols..

right, again, digression. the progression of weapons seems a bit weird, mostly.

[banson]

machineguns arnt a bad way to go. vets can make machine guns go far and do lots of damage. . hell get them in a base and tear the place up.. lancers i generaly stick with . as i can do lots of good with them in campain.

about your prob in campain with ripples.. if you dont want to lose good units.. hash out a band of brother borgs and march em to the sensors.. once you kill a sensor in a given area, the rockets will not fire on you. so u got to scout and kill sensors.

[Boris]

This issue does not belong here, if you need help go to "help/troubleshooting... it seems that you are not yet crossed the entire mission, and do not make a topic like "hey guys"... be more specific about what your problem is.
Mod edit: This information is incorrect.

[lav_coyote25]

oooooo an expert ooooooo j/k

[Lancefighter]

This issue does not belong here, if you need help go to "help/troubleshooting... it seems that you are not yet crossed the entire mission, and do not make a topic like "hey guys"... be more specific about what your problem is.

hint: its not an issue per se. If it was an issue it wouldve been "LIKE OMG MISSILES OUT OF NOWHERE HALP"*
*dramatization*

The post is more 'oh hai guys, im new here, whats up? *possible discussion topic enclosed*'

Anyway, in other news: Things are a lot easier now that I do have CB towers and my own incredibly long-ranged artillery.

Now, one more thing - why do medium bodies look so.. wrong? the project bodies are very angular, but the project medium body is very curvy looking. On the other hand, the green ons are usually curvier, but the medium body is seemingly angular..

[Boris]

Now, one more thing - why do medium bodies look so.. wrong? the project bodies are very angular, but the project medium body is very curvy looking. On the other hand, the green ons are usually curvier, but the medium body is seemingly angular..

see topic viewtopic.php?f=33&t=4245&p=42087
download all new models and set graphics in warzone options to max.

[Zarel]

About machine-guns - they might be powerful agains AIs, but they have counters in multiplayer. If you have any balance suggestions, though, I'd love to hear them.

[Lancefighter]

though a little more playing of the campaign, it seems that machineguns lose their usefulness against tracked-green/black heavy bodies(nexus and.. collective?)

I suppose that makes sense, looking through the damage formula it would appear that as the armor level goes up, the most damage that can happen is 30% of (base*propulsion mult), although i will say its hard to keep track of what your highest damage upgrade is >.>
seems though, that a mixed assault gun and tank killer force would do better than a force of mixed assault cannons and tank killers

As a question, could someone explain the propulsion to me? .. I think.. the weight of all 3 design screens (body + propulsion + turret) are added together, and then.. divided by engine power, and multiplied by the propulsion speed modifier?
Now, how do I manage to get a HEAP bomb cobra vtol to go so much faster than the viper/python? (in my game, its around 500.. meters/second?, where as the heavy or light go around 200)
And yeah, how does the speed units compare to the building tiles? does it take a unit of 100 speed 1 second to cross 1 building tile?

[Zarel]

It's engine power times propulsion multiplier times terrain multiplier times experience bonus divided by total weight.

Your Cobra HEAP went faster since it had higher engine power. Light weapons are fastest on light bodies, heavier weapons are faster on heavier bodies.

[Lancefighter]

It's engine power times propulsion multiplier times terrain multiplier times experience bonus divided by total weight.

Your Cobra HEAP went faster since it had higher engine power. Light weapons are fastest on light bodies, heavier weapons are faster on heavier bodies.

oh thats a bit simpler.
but a HEAP is one of the heaviest weapons there is? a vtol railgun is only 1k, whereas the HEAP is 3.8k.. both light and heavy bodies are around 200-300 speed (i usually rarely have vtols slower than 700, with bombs being the only ones..) perhaps id have to graph out the relationship better to understand it, but it seems a tad odd it works like this

edit, wait.. wait..
my command turret tiger tracks has:
engine: 25200
weight: 25750
tracks: 80%
terrainmult?

and speed of 93/78 (road/offroad)

engine*tracks*terrain/weight = speed
.7820*terrain = 78
ok, so the offroad terrain mult is 100, easy enough.
(side note: is the guide a bit off? HEAP ingame is 10k weight, the guide says 3800?)
cobra HEAP vtol
13000 weight
21000 engine
140% for vtol
x for terrain mult
587 speed

21000*1.4*x/13000=567
2.261*x
~250=x makes it work well enough.

mantis body:
28000*1.4*250/13150=257?
2.98*x=257
x=86?
in this case, the terrain mult is either NOT 250ish, or there is a hidden bodysizemult somewhere?
working calculations assuming xsubL=86..(making xsubM=250)

HEAP tiger vtol:
25200*1.4*86/15010=202
Yep, that works.

Now it all makes sense - I could not understand why upgrading to the mantis, an upgrade that adds 150 weight and 7000 engine slows me down by 300 speed.

Damn you hidden attribute gods!

[Zarel]

Oh, yeah, there are hidden body size mults. 0.75 for medium, 0.25 for heavy, only applies to VTOL. I've been meaning to get rid of those, actually.

[Lancefighter]

well, it does give medium bodies a use - I have no reason to use a medium body on a vtol if a heavy body goes the same speed for more survivability ( i suppose reloadtime is a point, seems to average around 4-5x reloadtime (for a small vs large), but when you add 10,000 weight for the HEAP bay, its almost irrelevant how heavy the body is. )

honestly I couldnt really offer balance suggestions until I go through and mod some stuff together for myself, but I certainly would like to see a differentiation in speed between heavy and light vtols

[banson]

i never did do the calcs for vtol speeds but i have noticed the ai usualy wants to make mantis lancers.. and ye i never noticed a speed diff on reloads. for the diff types of bodys like light heavy and med... of course i never use heavy vtols . is there a reload diff time?

[Lancefighter]

i never did do the calcs for vtol speeds but i have noticed the ai usualy wants to make mantis lancers.. and ye i never noticed a speed diff on reloads. for the diff types of bodys like light heavy and med... of course i never use heavy vtols . is there a reload diff time?

according to the wiki, it takes weight/100(times applicable upgrades)

according to my estimate, and assuming the guide is right, it will take about 7 seconds for a lancer bug vtol to reload.
the same lancer mantis vtol would take an additional twenty seconds (ish)

[banson]

thanks