Vote for the most useless T1 weapon

[Solitaire]

1. Light Cannon. Just so crap. Maximum OUF IMHO
2. Mini-Pod. The only reason it isn't no.1 is because a. rockets are intrinsically 1337 and b. I use it in small amounts in CAM1 to assist Heavy MGs in clearing Scavs and weaker NP vehicles while Lancers/MCan/HCan nail the big boys. High OUF.
3. I don't use the Flamer much either, but in MP/Skirmish a smart/aggressive T1 player may use it within a TMG/HMG rush to break MG bunkers and clumps of Vipers very effectively for its cost. Mid-high OUF.
4. MRLs were pretty good but they seem to be a bit less effective in 1.12 in spite of the range boost. Yeah they're slow but they hit hard and are very effective against all targets except heavy tanks. They're really designed as mobile close fire support for tank columns and I use it as such in CAM1/2 but this idea gets lost in the zero-strategy rush mentality of MP/Skirmish Only moderate OUF and its because of broken overall MP balance!

[themousemaster]

I invented a TLA.

How many geek points is that... ;p

[GiGaBaNE]

i think the light cannon is rather usefull, i play a defensive strategy and after i choose the area for my main base i will completly seal it shut with a ring of MG bunkers backed up by light cannon bunkers, then throw in mortars when they appear. this allowes me freedom to spend all my money on researching power and research upgrades, then ill retrofit my defence line with assault gun bunkers/pulse laser/scourge(or HVC hardpoints) with hellstorm howies.

So my vote goes to the minipod. the most useless weapon in the game. it is my hope that one of you guru's can change the nature of this weapon. If this weapon became not a weapon at all but an anti missle/bomb emplacement it would be far more effective. in short it could become what patriot missles are meant to be, and i would find nothing more grattifying than to see my enemy sending volley after volley of angel missles into my base only to see them shot down by a mini pod tower...worth a thought imho

[DFStormbringer]

I think its no need to rebalance game now. Ma be in future only.

For me heavymachingun is the POWER in T1. I always res. twinmachinegun  & build its at first not too much (5-15) than res. H.machingun & make a "serial" production of its . (20-40 units). Its enough to destroy everything on their way.

^^^
yo.. 20-40 of any unit can devestate a base lol
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the twins are totally useless.. no sooner you get the twin researched and the HMG immediatly shows up with better stats making it totally useless

The rocket artillery IS in the artillery class as it fires "up and over" things instead of directly at them and thus make them great for behind walls in pits behind hills and the like where they can shoot but cant be shot back.. in an early 1 vs 7 game they are VERY helpfull at bottlenecks.  as are the rocket pods as they do more damage per second then the MGs or the cannns and vs a 7 cpu allied team when resources are critical.. you dont have ti me to hit hte lancer tech fast enough to put up a decent defence.. even if you get lancers you have to research alot of the lance tech for the accuracy damage and most important reload to be of use vs 50+ attacking units nonstop.

light cannon. the computer dont even use it.. its too weak and fires too slow and is overshadowed by the medium too quicky.

flamers also vastly useless....  great damage.. but the computer nor human opponents are dumb enough to get near them.. by the time they do they are so armored that the flamers great damage no longer exsists even with the al the upgrades.. the entire flamer tech tree is useless.

then again its all useless being you can have rotery MG bunkers.. and pulse lasers with auto repair in an HOUR! which outclass anything in the game....
sure thier range blows compared to the gaus cannon but is a much shorter tech tree.. and when place on votols and a strike turret... the weak damage and accuracy of atillery makes it just a waste of resources... when 3-4 pulse shots can take down anything.

[Watermelon]

^^^
yo.. 20-40 of any unit can devestate a base lol
===========================

the twins are totally useless.. no sooner you get the twin researched and the HMG immediatly shows up with better stats making it totally useless

The rocket artillery IS in the artillery class as it fires "up and over" things instead of directly at them and thus make them great for behind walls in pits behind hills and the like where they can shoot but cant be shot back.. in an early 1 vs 7 game they are VERY helpfull at bottlenecks.  as are the rocket pods as they do more damage per second then the MGs or the cannns and vs a 7 cpu allied team when resources are critical.. you dont have ti me to hit hte lancer tech fast enough to put up a decent defence.. even if you get lancers you have to research alot of the lance tech for the accuracy damage and most important reload to be of use vs 50+ attacking units nonstop.

light cannon. the computer dont even use it.. its too weak and fires too slow and is overshadowed by the medium too quicky.

flamers also vastly useless....  great damage.. but the computer nor human opponents are dumb enough to get near them.. by the time they do they are so armored that the flamers great damage no longer exsists even with the al the upgrades.. the entire flamer tech tree is useless.

then again its all useless being you can have rotery MG bunkers.. and pulse lasers with auto repair in an HOUR! which outclass anything in the game....
sure thier range blows compared to the gaus cannon but is a much shorter tech tree.. and when place on votols and a strike turret... the weak damage and accuracy of atillery makes it just a waste of resources... when 3-4 pulse shots can take down anything.

yes flame weapons suck hard...there is absolutely no point of having a melee weapon in a skirmish/mp game where others use units that shoot HE sabot or sci-fi lasers or some crazy ballistic missiles...

not sure what is rotary mg bunker?maybe it's just the 'mg bunker'?

there are just way many useless weapons in all tech levels...so I would recommend the topic starter Troman to change his poll thread's names to 'vote for the weapons in T[number] with the highest OUF'  ;D

edit:or add new poll option called 'they all suck'...

[KBlair]

Light cannon easily, it's just so useless!

[themousemaster]

yes flame weapons suck hard...there is absolutely no point of having a melee weapon in a skirmish/mp game where others use units that shoot HE sabot or sci-fi lasers or some crazy ballistic missiles...

not sure what is rotary mg bunker?maybe it's just the 'mg bunker'?

there are just way many useless weapons in all tech levels...so I would recommend the topic starter Troman to change his poll thread's names to 'vote for the weapons in T[number] with the highest OUF'  ;D

edit:or add new poll option called 'they all suck'...

Rotary MG bunker is a defensive structure researchable after you have compelted the assault Gun research.

And flame weapons are good for 2 things: really early rushes, and loading up on Vtols to make whole enemy bases burn by scatter-dropping them around an enemy camp.

[DFStormbringer]

as stated above.. the Rotary MG Bunker is available for research after the assault gun is researched..  and has double the rate of fire as the regular MG.. 4 times the HP.. and 4 times the damage.. i use them as the outer line of ALL my defences.. as they have more HP in a structure then almost any other defence building except for the twin vulcan?  its the blue version of the twin assault gun and  instead of it being IN the bunker it sits on top like a flamer.. THATS the building wiht the  best defence and HP but requires a fair ammount of AA research and a tiny bit of cannon research to get to it.

with full upgrades the rotary MG can easilly match if not do more damage then the defences they are protecting

and as i said earlier.. the rockets are so not useless in an alliance game.. as the time it takes to research rockets.. then lancers.. then the lancer bunker.. and then the lancer upgrades for them to get a decent damage and ROF.. if your still haning onto nothing but MG bunkers in a 8 man alliance game..  your MG bunekrs are not going to hold out 50+ units by themselvs.. and those rockets come in very handy for thinning out the  herd..

and for maps like mizamaze or any other map that has a bottleneck where you can get on the elevated ground  over your enemy.. rocket artillery is PERFECT for that being moarters are so far down the tech tree.... [in an alliance game.. seconds count]..  and allows you to place several rocket artillery up on the cliff back out of the enemys line of sight and allows y ou to continually  bombard them while you dont have to worry about constantly repairing them.. yoou can just focus on your main defensive line.

[Ziasod]

what's wrong with Twin Machinegun? recall zerging n00b foo's with hole fleet of them

[themousemaster]

as stated above.. the Rotary MG Bunker is available for research after the assault gun is researched..  and has double the rate of fire as the regular MG.. 4 times the HP.. and 4 times the damage.. i use them as the outer line of ALL my defences.. as they have more HP in a structure then almost any other defence building except for the twin vulcan?  its the blue version of the twin assault gun and  instead of it being IN the bunker it sits on top like a flamer.. THATS the building wiht the  best defence and HP but requires a fair ammount of AA research and a tiny bit of cannon research to get to it.

with full upgrades the rotary MG can easilly match if not do more damage then the defences they are protecting

The final bunker in the current game is the Twin Assault Cannon.


Oh, and the rotary MG does have a decent damage and RoF advantage over a normal MG bunker (just like the asault gun does over the HMG), but that's only if you are facing light, or sparsely armor-upgraded medium, bodied units.  A heavy chassie of any type will only be taking 1 damage per bullet from even a rotary.  Which is fine, if you are up against the stock AI that likes to send 40 waves of light and medium-hover units before anything else, but if a human sees you turtling with Rotary MG's, he will counter with a few Python-or-Mantis units.

Diversity in your defenses man! ;p

[kage]

Diversity in your defenses man! ;p

the only problem with that is that defs don't attack the most optimal target, so it's easy to build a few cheap units to soak up an entire wave of lancers and then send in a 3 bunker busters to wipe out several turrets before the second wave of lancers. might be useful to add a fix for that in the form of a "command tower" and/or extend the "attach to commander" behavior of emplaced artillery to apply to all in-range defenses while simultaneously giving commanders target-optimization code (once again, making commanders useful on the battlefield -- especially in multiplayer games).

[Troman]

there are just way many useless weapons in all tech levels...so I would recommend the topic starter Troman to change his poll thread's names to 'vote for the weapons in T[number] with the highest OUF'  ;D

edit:or add new poll option called 'they all suck'...

Hehe well 4 of the T1 weapons listed here do suck IMHO.

[themousemaster]

the only problem with that is that defs don't attack the most optimal target, so it's easy to build a few cheap units to soak up an entire wave of lancers and then send in a 3 bunker busters to wipe out several turrets before the second wave of lancers. might be useful to add a fix for that in the form of a "command tower" and/or extend the "attach to commander" behavior of emplaced artillery to apply to all in-range defenses while simultaneously giving commanders target-optimization code (once again, making commanders useful on the battlefield -- especially in multiplayer games).

That's not a problem unique to any specific defensive structure though, that's true of all bunker/hardpoints.

True diversity in your defenses means having some Units with the Bunkers for just that purpose ;p.

[Troman]

the only problem with that is that defs don't attack the most optimal target, so it's easy to build a few cheap units to soak up an entire wave of lancers and then send in a 3 bunker busters to wipe out several turrets before the second wave of lancers.

They do now, as well as units. Although I don't know if that got included into 2.0.7 or whether it will come with 2.1 .

[DFStormbringer]

ive stated enough times that i only play vs the cpu..nobody for me to play with even then i perfer to have humans as an ally... unless its say a 2v2+ human which will never happen wiht me.