2c-Twinny Hilly -- Done!

[Michal]

My second attempt at making a map using FlaME. I just wanted to see how it would go, it's a small map (64x128) for 2 players.
It's pretty symmetrical, bases are on elevated hills, thus the name . And a bit of hills here and there. I tried to make topography and textures interesting (monocolour maps hurt my eyes). Only 2 oil in each base, and 12 scattered outside - to encourage smaller, local battles. Hills block sensors and can serve as outpost foundations.

It's still 'beta' - no bases, roads, huts, scavengers.

Let me know if you like it (yes, I do get motivation from that kind of things ). I don't yet know all the tricks (how Olrox made those cool 'map screenshots'), but hope I'll find out soon , cheers.


EDIT:
Version 1:
Scavengers and advanced bases added.
- 4 oil in each base
- 2 oil possible to grab right away
- another few requires some basic fighting force - I hope scavs can surprise you
- 3 scavengers bases to pillage, 2 oil in each.

+ some minor terrain fixes

Scavengers highly recomended. Let me know If you find the map unbalaced in any way, or some textures don't match.

If everything is ok, I'll add some dirt roads, huts and ruins. Unfortunetely, when I first tried them I had problems - some roofs were missing etc.

EDIT2:

Map completed:
- scav mortar fix
- added craters, huts, dirt roads
- some really small terrain fixes

It got tested by few of my friends, so there shouldn't be any problems. Feel free to report any though.

2c-TwinnyHilly.JPG

2c-TwinnyHilly.wz

[Olrox]

It's looking nice, didn't play it yet (viewed it in flaME for a better overview) but I'm wondering if it isn't too few oil, even on high power. A good ammount to play with high power currently is the sufficient so that each player got at least 3 generators worth of resources in an ideally divided situation (almost double of what you've used), IMO.

But I like your approach for gameplay depth, reminds me of what I've done in Arena 22 with the sand dunes.

Also, a single oil resource is somewhat boring to defend, especialy with low power, I myself prefer to place them 2 by 2. but like that, you'd need to give a good reason for the players to settle down on their bases and not simply go pushing with defensive structures from the beginning of the game. A good way of doing that is to allow obviously better ways of defending a specific position rather than adding a whole lot of oil in it.

I'm still thinking about making a "nomadic" map, where the players must initially decide where to start building their bases. I'm still thinking how I'll manage to do that, right now I don't really know.

But go on - I'm sure you can make fine maps, and this one is just on the right path!

Thumbs up

~Olrox

[Michal]

Sorry for messing up your name

I'm thinking of adding 2 more resources at the edge of each players base - so that mortars can attack them if you get close enough.

I plan to add scavengers as 'highly recommended' option to prevent early defense rush. That would add 2 more oil for each player.


Also, I want this map to bit a bit 'new players friendly'. On Keep of The Grass I played with at least 5 people who refused to take oil resources and managed to beat them with 1,5 generator.

[Olrox]

Sorry for messing up your name

I'm thinking of adding 2 more resources at the edge of each players base - so that mortars can attack them if you get close enough.

I plan to add scavengers as 'highly recommended' option to prevent early defense rush. That would add 2 more oil for each player.


Also, I want this map to bit a bit 'new players friendly'. On Keep of The Grass I played with at least 5 people who refused to take oil resources and managed to beat them with 1,5 generator.

No problem about my name - I've just edited 'cause I could, nothing really troublesome

I think that adding those new resources will make the map play more smoothly, it's kind of annoying when you've got to stop all research to produce a 30-cyborg force

Scavengers would be very nice, also.

~Olrox

[Alpha93]

Really,REALLY interesting map to play on. Make more kthx.

[Michal]

Really,REALLY interesting map to play on. Make more kthx.

Thanks.

I added 2 more oil in each base, and started working on scavenger bases - 3 are planned, on those 'concrete parts' (one close to each player, and one in center when 2 oil derrics are now).
Scavs close to played bases won't have much units, but stronger defence than most you see out there - something a bit harder to destroy if you don't have mortars. Still, it will be possible to avoid them. Those in center will have more units, so you can meet a scavenger patrol .

Once I finish this and get used to FlaME, I plan to make a 4 player map, I'm a bit bored with those I have already .

[Michal]

First post edited, new version out

[Viper1986]

I love the map, setup is really nice, good competition for the forward power sources.

[Michal]

Thanks but... The scavenger mortar is firing at the #1 base and some fighting starts - that's not fair, I gotta fix it.

[Michal]

Just a shameless dump, so that the 1st post edition is visible for those who use only 'view new posts' while browsing.

I consider the map done, and quite a fun. Now I'm off to make some 2v2.

Thanks to 'beta testers'! I hope you'll enjoy the final version even more.

[KenAlcock]

Hey Michal, I've played this map a few times now against a Beta 12a max AI. The map is very well done. I really like medium power maps with interesting terrain features. I would love to see you take a crack at a very large 4P or 8P map. Maybe even you could expand on this map to largest size WZ allows?

Here are some constructive criticisms. Consider these tweaking suggestions more than anything.

Each player's base area contains two power resources near the cliff edges of that player's base which cannot be defended. What I mean is no walls can be built between the cliff edge and the oil resource itself. Thus, any direct fire enemy units driving below either base's cliff can just sit back and shoot these power resources at-will. It would be better IMHO, if they were moved back one or two tiles to allow defenses (say a wall or hard point) to be built between them and the cliff edge.

IMHO, each base area would be ideal with two more power resources in the rear. That is, away from each player's base area entrances and closer to the corner where each player's trucks first start off the game. This would also help game play when one player has grabbed all the forward oil bases and the other player is left only with the oil in his base. Making a defensive stand with only two defensible oil derricks is impossible.

There are a couple of power resources that are somewhat buried, I almost cannot see one of them (north of Player 0's main base on a hill immediately east of the paved area with two other power resources). since I've never made a map myself, I have no suggestions how to fix that.

All-in-all though this is a very solid map. Please make more!

[Olrox]

There are a couple of power resources that are somewhat buried, I almost cannot see one of them (north of Player 0's main base on a hill immediately east of the paved area with two other power resources). since I've never made a map myself, I have no suggestions how to fix that.

You just need to use "set height" with the same values on all four corners of the tile, to make it absolutely flat, and then place the resources - it takes literally a few seconds

~Olrox

[Michal]

Geez, and I was waiting quite a while, so that 'final' version would avoid this kind of stuff. No problem though. I need other people to look at my work and show me what I missed.
Its almost the first map I made, that's why its small size. I have in mind something for 4P (I am very, very bored with those I have already).

I recently played that with a human player and scavengers, and yes, extra oil is needed, even on Advanced bases gameplay soon slowed down too much.

Each player's base area contains two power resources near the cliff edges of that player's base which cannot be defended. What I mean is no walls can be built between the cliff edge and the oil resource itself.

You sure you have the final version? I see on flaME that there are 1-2 emty spaces between the oil and cliff. You cannot build on those?
They were supposed to be a little exposed to mortar fire, but I haven't thought that direct fire can get them...


Check this version - +2 oil in bases, forward oil in each base moved away from cliffs, fixed buried oil:

2c-TwinnyHillyVS.wz

[Per]

I tested the map with scavengers, and the scavs were way too tough. The AI presented no problem at all, since it was prevented from expanding by the super strong scavs. So once I mopped up the (eventually quite considerable) scav forces, rolling over the AI was merely a chore.

BTW, I thought there was enough oil on the map.

[Michal]

Tough scavengers are just an experiment - I thought of a way to prevent rushing to critical passages and building up defences. You can always turn them off.
Unfortunetely, the AI gets mopped by scavs... well, I play mostly with humans, so I don't really know how it reacts (and it's kinda stupid for me, but well, thats only a simple brain compared to humans).
As far as I know - Fishnets also has pretty strong scavengers (?) but you can avoid them.


Well, oil is subjective matter. There are 2 versions now, so anyone can see for themsefl.