2.3, double turret dragon?

[kainalu]

Im a little confused,

I have been reading about the 2.3 release having double turret dragons, but cannot find a solid reference or screenshot. I cannot compile the source to try it, so...... anyone can confirm that? also, will it allow ALL turrets to be doubled? like, double gauss or plasma?


EDIT: Question answered on 2.3 forum already, Zarel said "Yes, as long as they're both weapons."

[Zarel]

Here's a screenshot.

multiturret.jpg

[kainalu]

two different turrets? No way, too cool!

[KenAlcock]

Want to have some fun?

Place a Nexus turret in the back and an EMP Cannon in the front. Then go off with a platoon of those and collect and convert enemy units at-will. Just be careful to have each of your units to attack different enemy units otherwise you'll end getting your own units with EMP splash.

[kainalu]

Thats almost....um.....evil

Please remind me never to battle you

[KukY]

Thats almost....um.....evil

Please remind me never to battle you

That IS evil. I like to do that to AI

One of you will win beforu you get both Nexus Link and EMP.

[dragonflythecat]

What is the reasoning behind this modification?

Wasn't the Dragon Body big and slow enough as it was?

I noticed when you align two turrets together they often overlap one another - does that effect game play?

Can one Dragon do double duty?

Can both turrets fire at the same time or is it the firing sequenced?

When this mod was considered in what configuration of a Dragon Body was examine as to be worthwhile to build and use?

It seemed to me that only the Nexus Turret as a primary and anything else as a secondary turret in front -

I saw the screen shot but I also consider the Archangels primary a base defense - something else about this game is Tactics or lack of them. In my own experience I noticed that when I order the tanks to attack my opponent, they shoot off like an arrow and 'battering-ram' their way to the attack point through every obstacle in their path.

So I don't see the reasoning behind having Ripple Rockets and Archangel Missiles as tank turrets, since they have to be stationary to target and fire and it is far easier to use trucks to build those same base defenses and cheaper.

What is the build time and price for a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Does the dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon have more armor than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon based upon added weight of two turrets as opposed to one?

How much slower is a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon based on added weight of two turrets as opposed to one when considering maneuverability?

Anything short of Hover Propulsion and it is the same as a rock?

What or which opposing weapons; base defenses/turrets is the best defense against a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Will a battery of Ripple Rockets or Archangels destroy it as easy as destroying a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Does the dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon have more hit points than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

For instance, how many dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragons would it take to do battle against one Missile Fortress or Mass Driver and win as opposed to how many single turret Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragons?

Which Maps require a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon to win?

This is one of those little modifications the Development Teams has made lately that leave some Beta Testers questioning your use of your time and resources and the direction this game is going.

It truly seems unnecessary. There are far better ways to enhance this game and use your time to our benefit.

Dragonfly The Cat

[KukY]

What is the reasoning behind this modification?
Wasn't the Dragon Body big and slow enough as it was?
I noticed when you align two turrets together they often overlap one another - does that effect game play?
Can one Dragon do double duty?
Can both turrets fire at the same time or is it the firing sequenced?

Reason was to make Dragon specal.
Well, it is very strong, and there has to be some balance.
Don't worry about overlaping, just take care that you destroy your enemy
How do you mean?
They can fire at same time.

[3drts]

Geez, enough questions.....
It mounts two weapons, it makes the super heavy body more powerful -
He just gave you an example, some weapon combinations will obviously not make much sense, just as some turret+propulsion+body combinations don't make sense (tracked Python with a light machine gun anyone?, heavy weapon on a tracked leopard that is slow as crap and easy to kill, tracked flamer units against hover rocket units, etc).

Personally, playing with multi turrets, I liked A heavy cannon+ light machinegun Python, if for no other reason than aesthetics+ concept (plus the mg is a cheapo turret that adds more hp for only 10 more power and an insignificant effect on speed).

Twin Pulse laser was popular back when a mantis could mount two turrets, or you could do Scourge+pulse to have an al around tank (although an expensive one).

Lower tech than pulse, when going the lancer route on high oil maps, I also liked to occasionally throw on a bunker buster with the lancers (with most tanks being just single lancers, in a ≈3:1 ratio) to give my tank group some punch against static defenses while still staying in the rocket tech tree.

Think of combinations for yourself, thats one of the major themes in WZ - you now have a body you can customize just a little more to a role you want.

If you feel archangel+ plasma has a role, than go for it, I believe the tank only considers the range of its first weapon when moving to fire - so an archangel+ plasma could stay out of range, and lob rockets onto an enemy base, and if some hoverflamers, the plasma would chew them up.
Would still probably be more cost effective (and result in a faster force) to just build separate tanks with plasma.

However, when there are narrow canyons/chokepoints, you may want to be able to pack more firepower into the small amount of units that can fit through, and you may go for double turret units simply for firepower concentration, despite the fact they cost nearly as much as 2 single turret units, but their HP is barely above that of a single turret unit.
It may also be useful for experienced units, or if you are approaching the unit cap.

[Zarel]

What is the reasoning behind this modification?

A lot of players wanted a multi-turret body. So I gave it to them.

Wasn't the Dragon Body big and slow enough as it was?

Well, yes, that's what makes it balanced!

I noticed when you align two turrets together they often overlap one another - does that effect game play?

Nope, it's purely visual.

Can one Dragon do double duty?

Can both turrets fire at the same time or is it the firing sequenced?

Yes, they can fire at the same time. Is that what you meant by "double duty"? If not, I'm not sure I understand you.

When this mod was considered in what configuration of a Dragon Body was examine as to be worthwhile to build and use?

Two of the same (light) turret works well, for additional firepower. Combining strengths and weaknesses, too, such as Scourge+Seraph, or Scourge+Pulse. Or you could just get a twin Gauss, for massive firepower.

Beyond that, we're really hoping the users will discover for themselves what works well and what doesn't.

It seemed to me that only the Nexus Turret as a primary and anything else as a secondary turret in front -

Nexus+EMP is indeed a potent combination, but I think combining it with a normal weapon would kind of defeat the purpose - kill the enemy before you can take it over? Seems rather self-defeating.

I saw the screen shot but I also consider the Archangels primary a base defense - something else about this game is Tactics or lack of them. In my own experience I noticed that when I order the tanks to attack my opponent, they shoot off like an arrow and 'battering-ram' their way to the attack point through every obstacle in their path.

Yeah. If you want them to be more sane, use an attack-move: Alt+click on a destination, and they'll stop and shoot things on the way there.

As for Archies, I agree that they don't work well when mounted on a tank - I used it in the screenshot more because it looked good, than because it was actually effective.

So I don't see the reasoning behind having Ripple Rockets and Archangel Missiles as tank turrets, since they have to be stationary to target and fire and it is far easier to use trucks to build those same base defenses and cheaper.

I suppose, but being able to move can be a pretty big advantage. What if someone steamrolls your base? With tanks, you can retreat them to somewhere else.

What is the build time and price for a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

The same price as a single turret Dragon, plus the price of the other turret.

Does the dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon have more armor than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon based upon added weight of two turrets as opposed to one?

Nope. It does have additional HP, though (weapons add HP).

How much slower is a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon based on added weight of two turrets as opposed to one when considering maneuverability?

It's fairly significant - it can be quite a bit slower. That's just because cannons are some of the heaviest weapons in the game. With light weapons like pulse lasers, the difference is practically unnoticeable.

Anything short of Hover Propulsion and it is the same as a rock?

Well, I wouldn't say that. We do have a speed minimum of 10, if it comes to that. And as above, you can have two lighter turrets without much difficulty - even twin Gauss is manageable.

What or which opposing weapons; base defenses/turrets is the best defense against a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Scourge Missiles mounted on hovers are quite good for attrition. Wear them down before they can get to your base. Flamers on hovers or cyborgs also work decently well. VTOL Scourges aren't bad, either.

Will a battery of Ripple Rockets or Archangels destroy it as easy as destroying a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Not nearly as easily, no, but it shouldn't be too much of a difference.

Does the dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon have more hit points than a single Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon?

Yes. Weapons confer HP - for instance, Heavy Cannon comes with 450 HP - for details, see the Guide; HP is the first column after Name: http://guide.wz2100.net/w/

For instance, how many dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragons would it take to do battle against one Missile Fortress or Mass Driver and win as opposed to how many single turret Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragons?

I don't know. I guess you can find out by trying it.

Which Maps require a dual Assault or Heavy Cannon turret Dragon to win?

None of them. There are always many different strategies that work - no single strategy is required for anything.

This is one of those little modifications the Development Teams has made lately that leave some Beta Testers questioning your use of your time and resources and the direction this game is going.

I don't know - most users seem to love the idea. I implemented it specifically because so many users were asking for it.

If you disagree with it, I'm sure you could start a discussion with the other forum members, asking them. If you make such a thread, I'll be sure to add a poll to it.

It truly seems unnecessary. There are far better ways to enhance this game and use your time to our benefit.

I'm sorry to hear that. Could you name some of those better ways? I'd love to hear them.