Warzone 2100 Forums

Hi all. First off, I've made it to Campaign 2 Mission 2 in single player. Got a lil bored of fighting the AI and hopped online. I have the basic controls down, and how to move along the tech tree. What is the "Standard", most accepted, game setup(FoW/Resource/Base)? What maps are good to play on(1v1, 2v2)? Is there anyway to disable the random oil drums and artifact drops? What is considered a good open build/tech order?

I've been hosting games set with low resource and only trucks. I feel this makes the game as hard as it can be. Making players really play for their wins make things more fun for everyone. Is this the "Standard" though? I like the distance FoW. It can be confusing sometimes though. I have trouble telling where I've been and need to check. For online though, it keeps players from saying they don't know the map. I mostly play with it off.

I can kinda understand the artifact drops, but the barrels can win games.

Does everyone play one maps that start players out with 10-20 derricks? Are there places I can get good 2-4 player maps? I've been practicing on (4)Valley that come with the game. I like that you start with 4 derricks in the main and have 2 close by. This lets you make full use of your first generator, and not put you years away from needing a second one. I also like the 2 derricks out in the water at the 12 and 6 o'clock position on the map. Rewards the 1st player to make a hovertruck. Is there a tool to make maps?

In my practice I've been opening with factory then generator while making 3 more trucks. When the generator finishes I start a research lab and get the 1st truck out to start taking derricks. After the lab is done I get to work on a command center and the machine gun then engineering. From here all the rest of my truck go on making the center. Is this ok so far? When the center finishes I make the blueprint for Python/Wheel/MG tanks and set my factories to continual produce. Back to making labs, two more. Tank number 1 is used to locate my opponent(s). And then...?

Once I do find my opponent there is now way to tell what they're teching to. Is this why so many people play in a turtle fashion? Not knowing what they're gonna be sending so you try to cover all angles/styles?

Anyways, having fun with learning it so far. The tech tree is crazy confusing. I figured out how to get right to VTOL prop, is that good? I didn't get much done with them considering they don't auto fire, you have to click on the targets manually. I normally just try to rush my opponent with a few tanks early to mess with their game while I tech to Cobra/HT/TMG tanks from three factories for the kill. It has worked a couple of games. It went horrible sory one game though. When I engaged my opponent, he had the first gold body and I don't know what for weapons, but I couldn't hurt them for nothin with TMGs and they melted my tanks.

tehloserer wrote:Hi all. First off, I've made it to Campaign 2 Mission 2 in single player. Got a lil bored of fighting the AI and hopped online. I have the basic controls down, and how to move along the tech tree. What is the "Standard", most accepted, game setup(FoW/Resource/Base)? What maps are good to play on(1v1, 2v2)? Is there anyway to disable the random oil drums and artifact drops? What is considered a good open build/tech order?

There isn't any "real" standard, but most skilled players like Fog of War (it helps you remember where you've been), Low or Medium power, and maps with no more than 8 oil resources in the starting base. No Bases, Bases, and Advanced Bases are all played (No Bases is played the most), and they all have their advantages.

The random oil drums and artifacts can't be disabled; sorry. The oil drums serve as a good equalizer - players that aren't that good at keeping oil resources can still get enough to get by. The artifacts are mostly useless, so they aren't bad... They can also serve as an equalizer, since you can attack turtles to get their tech.

tehloserer wrote:I've been hosting games set with low resource and only trucks. I feel this makes the game as hard as it can be. Making players really play for their wins make things more fun for everyone. Is this the "Standard" though? I like the distance FoW. It can be confusing sometimes though. I have trouble telling where I've been and need to check. For online though, it keeps players from saying they don't know the map. I mostly play with it off.

"Only trucks" has a minor problem of the game turning into a truck rush on small maps - everyone doing nothing but building MG towers in the early game, generally in other players' bases. Small maps suffer from rush problems on pretty much any map, though.

tehloserer wrote:I can kinda understand the artifact drops, but the barrels can win games.

They're intended to. See above.

tehloserer wrote:Does everyone play one maps that start players out with 10-20 derricks? Are there places I can get good 2-4 player maps? I've been practicing on (4)Valley that come with the game. I like that you start with 4 derricks in the main and have 2 close by. This lets you make full use of your first generator, and not put you years away from needing a second one. I also like the 2 derricks out in the water at the 12 and 6 o'clock position on the map. Rewards the 1st player to make a hovertruck. Is there a tool to make maps?

A lot of players play maps that do that. Personally, I hate it; I prefer 8 oil resources in starting base, max. There aren't very many maps except the defaults; the "Showcase" forum is a good place to look if you're getting tired of the defaults.

There's a tool to make maps called EditWorld, but it kind of sucks and is hard to use. :/ We're working on a better one.

tehloserer wrote:In my practice I've been opening with factory then generator while making 3 more trucks. When the generator finishes I start a research lab and get the 1st truck out to start taking derricks. After the lab is done I get to work on a command center and the machine gun then engineering. From here all the rest of my truck go on making the center. Is this ok so far? When the center finishes I make the blueprint for Python/Wheel/MG tanks and set my factories to continual produce. Back to making labs, two more. Tank number 1 is used to locate my opponent(s). And then...?

The premier strategy on smaller maps is called The Tower Rush.

It goes a little something like this:

1. Both trucks, Research Facility, ASAP.
2. Queue Truck 1 to build a Factory, then Generator, then your starter Derricks.
3. When the Research Facility is around 70% done, send Truck 2 to the enemy base, tagging* oil resources along the way.
4. When the Research Facility is done, research MG, ASAP.
5. MG should finish very quickly. Research MG Tower, ASAP.
6. Position your Truck 2 right outside your enemy base, and wait.
7. When MG Tower is about 85% done researching, move Truck 2 inside the enemy base. Build an MG tower at the SE corner of their factory. If they're too slow for a factory, put an MG tower at the entrance and the rest near their trucks.
8. Factory finished? Build 3 trucks, ASAP.
9. Coordinate your MG Tower building and base expansion.
10. Win (I think my record was around 50 seconds from game start)

* Tagging means starting to build the derrick, but not finishing. This prevents your opponent from building on the resources, without spending too much of your own time, which you need to conserve in the early-game.

tehloserer wrote:Once I do find my opponent there is now way to tell what they're teching to. Is this why so many people play in a turtle fashion? Not knowing what they're gonna be sending so you try to cover all angles/styles?

No, they play full turtle because it's the best strategy against the AI, and many players are used to the AI. Take advantage of it by rushing them.

tehloserer wrote:Anyways, having fun with learning it so far. The tech tree is crazy confusing. I figured out how to get right to VTOL prop, is that good? I didn't get much done with them considering they don't auto fire, you have to click on the targets manually. I normally just try to rush my opponent with a few tanks early to mess with their game while I tech to Cobra/HT/TMG tanks from three factories for the kill. It has worked a couple of games. It went horrible sory one game though. When I engaged my opponent, he had the first gold body and I don't know what for weapons, but I couldn't hurt them for nothin with TMGs and they melted my tanks.

Heh, have you seen the entire tech tree? You can visualize it here: http://guide.wz2100.net/r/tech-tree

VTOL propulsion is underrated right now, so I really can't tell you how good a VTOL strategy is. I'm sure you'll be able to do well with it, though.

Another hint: HMG is one of the best weapons in the earlygame; an HMG rush can be devastating if done correctly. TMGs are decent, but still kind of weak in comparison, and you get HMG right afterwards, anyway.

Zarel wrote:The premier strategy on smaller maps is called The Tower Rush.

It goes a little something like this:

1. Both trucks, Research Facility, ASAP.
2. Queue Truck 1 to build a Factory, then Generator, then your starter Derricks.
3. When the Research Facility is around 70% done, send Truck 2 to the enemy base, tagging* oil resources along the way.
4. When the Research Facility is done, research MG, ASAP.
5. MG should finish very quickly. Research MG Tower, ASAP.
6. Position your Truck 2 right outside your enemy base, and wait.
7. When MG Tower is about 85% done researching, move Truck 2 inside the enemy base. Build an MG tower at the SE corner of their factory. If they're too slow for a factory, put an MG tower at the entrance and the rest near their trucks.
8. Factory finished? Build 3 trucks, ASAP.
9. Coordinate your MG Tower building and base expansion.
10. Win (I think my record was around 50 seconds from game start)

* Tagging means starting to build the derrick, but not finishing. This prevents your opponent from building on the resources, without spending too much of your own time, which you need to conserve in the early-game.

And the proper counter to this would be to make tanks, tech slowly, and build your building way far apart from each other? Not to mention you have to know where they're starting so only REALLY valid on two player maps? I guess if you don't find them on the first try you can at least fall back on your towers for D while you tech to HMG? just sounds too shaky for my tastes.

tehloserer wrote:And the proper counter to this would be to make tanks, tech slowly, and build your building way far apart from each other?

Proper counter on a small map is to truck rush back. Really not much else you can do. :/

Proper counter on a larger map is to amass HMGs, and go mow down their poorly defended base.

And always, always tech quickly. Tech is the difference between life and death, man.

Zarel wrote: And always, always tech quickly. Tech is the difference between life and death, man.

keep this in mind every game you play

tehloserer wrote:Not to mention you have to know where they're starting so only REALLY valid on two player maps? I guess if you don't find them on the first try you can at least fall back on your towers for D while you tech to HMG? just sounds too shaky for my tastes.

Well, you know where they're starting on every map. What do you think the number under their flag means?

It's indeed very shaky. After all, no risk, no reward.

* Tagging means starting to build the derrick, but not finishing. This prevents your opponent from building on the resources, without spending too much of your own time, which you need to conserve in the early-game.

that does not work anymore and thankyou to the devs!!!! if you stop building on some thing now - it goes back to nothing within a certain span of time... i am not positive on the tick count but zarel or one of the others will pop in and tell you.

lav_coyote25 wrote:that does not work anymore and thankyou to the devs!!!! if you stop building on some thing now - it goes back to nothing within a certain span of time... i am not positive on the tick count but zarel or one of the others will pop in and tell you.

It works on derricks and walls. As long as you finish accruing the power, the building will stay. Buildings will only go back to nothing (takes a few seconds) if you leave before finishing the power-accruing phase.

(That's 2.2 - trunk uses an entirely different solution)

well - if i had my way - it would be NO partial builds at all. end of sentence. i know all the fors and all the againsts - it is time to go to the none side. xD

I'm cool with partial buildings, just takes 1-2 shots from a tank to get rid of it. I get a tank out to scout opponent ASAP. Gotta know if they're making defense and how many factory/labs they have. So if I run into this in a game, that tank should clear those out in passing as it heads to their base, hopefully after holding off rush.

Round two of noob questions. Do weapon upgrade increase the strength of defense structures (MG up make MG tower better)? Do all MG up apply to TMG and HMG as well? How much do you get back when you recycle/sell something? Does health effect how much you get back when you recycle/sell? Is building/unit/upgrade cost directly related to completion time? Does having multiple trucks building the same thing cost more resource than having 1 build it? How much does each truck beyond the first one help? How is targeting priority handled for defense?

I've started bringing a truck with me when I attack. Serves two purposes, clears them out faster and makes setting up there that much easier/faster. Take derricks as soon as they stop burning. Can a brother get a water hose upgrade for repair turret? J/k about that.

Still having fun with it. Even when I get cussed for HMG rushing, and playing aggressively. ^_^ Those games are the most rewarding ^_^

tehloserer wrote:Round two of noob questions. Do weapon upgrade increase the strength of defense structures (MG up make MG tower better)? Do all MG up apply to TMG and HMG as well? How much do you get back when you recycle/sell something? Does health effect how much you get back when you recycle/sell? Is building/unit/upgrade cost directly related to completion time? Does having multiple trucks building the same thing cost more resource than having 1 build it? How much does each truck beyond the first one help? How is targeting priority handled for defense?

Yes. Yes. 50%. No. Kind of (more expensive things usually take longer to build, but there are exceptions and it's not a linear relationship). No. Linearly (I'm thinking of capping it at 3 at some point, but for now, there's no limit). For structures, priority is "closest unit or finished structure first, otherwise closest unfinished structure, otherwise closest wall". For units, it's a lot more complicated - it'll usually target whatever it does the most damage to.

tehloserer wrote:I've started bringing a truck with me when I attack. Serves two purposes, clears them out faster and makes setting up there that much easier/faster. Take derricks as soon as they stop burning. Can a brother get a water hose upgrade for repair turret? J/k about that.

Good idea with the truck.

I've been thinking of making derricks take longer to stop burning. Thoughts?

tehloserer wrote:Still having fun with it. Even when I get cussed for HMG rushing, and playing aggressively. ^_^ Those games are the most rewarding ^_^

Yeah, well, my usual lancer strategy loses to HMG rushes. :/ I should work on balance (I stopped when 2.2.0 was released)...

Zarel wrote:I've been thinking of making derricks take longer to stop burning. Thoughts?

If you do that, I demand a water hose for my repair turrets! LOL. Still j/k. Think of how much fun the cyborgs will have with that. o.O. You could add a blue "flamer" animation with code to remove "burning", and do dmg to cyborgs?? Considering ppl only make flamer cyborgs it would be a funny fight to watch. This might also encourage ppl to research down that branch on the tree. Seriously though, coding and player acceptance considered, I know how hard it would be to add something like that.

Don't they burn longer in the campaign? If not it sure seems like it.

So it's a good idea to use run at light dmg and recycle until I get a repair station, or should I only recycle when I'm changing over to a new body style? I usually recycle everything I have with wheels when second round of hover tanks comes out.

There ever been a tourney or league? I was thinking about trying to start a league, but win reporting would be based soley on word of mouth and trust. No prize involved, just playing for fun under a "standard" game setup on a few choice maps.

tehloserer wrote: If you do that, I demand a water hose for my repair turrets! LOL.

If you do make a turret or a cyborg to put out oil fires then I say that oil wells should burn forever or untill you put them out.

Real world, right?

Hello! This is my first post here in quite a while, sorry about that. Back on topic, This is also why I don't like to play against others online, I don't mind losing fair-and-square, I however do not like cheating/trainers/bug exploits E.T.C while online, as many will also agree. I do use codes and debug mode offline against the computer for fun, but I can beat the computer with out them. I do like a fair match against people who play without cheats, I am however not very good in multiplayer, in the single player campaign I am an expert I also like to turtle against the computer, then pound them with heavies, rocket tanks, E.T.C.

Thanks for updating this classic game!

NEXUS,

NEXUS wrote:This is also why I don't like to play against others online, I don't mind losing fair-and-square, I however do not like cheating/trainers/bug exploits E.T.C while online, as many will also agree.

I don't hack/train/cheat. I wouldn't consider rushing for a certain tech, that is questionably imba, an exploit. If all players can do it, it's fair right? What's E.T.C.?

NEXUS wrote:I am however not very good in multiplayer

You beat me 1v1 with a mass of Viper/Wheel/MG tanks on some weird 8 player map, (8)SK-BeggarsKanyon. I had just made my first V/W/HMG tanks and had been making V/W/MG out of 2 factories up till then. I know you had more of the map than I did, the whole bottom I think. How many factories did you have? I also had bad info on map. I tried to send my army from the base just above you down into you base. Didn't know that there was not a path there like in other bases.

I'm up for a rematch on any of the following maps: (2)SK-HighGorund: (2)SK-Startup: (4)SK-GreatRift: (4)SK-RollingHills: (4)SK-UrbanDuel: (4)SK-Valley; using low resource and no base. I'm on almost all the time. Either shoot me a msg on here or find me in the IRC channel. We'll have a fun time. ^_^