Making balance mod

[Zarel]

Actually its quite interesting the effect that has on an army, most buildings heavily upgraded now stand, but for some reason walls and defenses do not, it seems that most building are hard enough to withstand the burn radius but defenses other than super cannons do not.

which brings me to the point that defenses seem to be weaker the normal buildings, and defenses are supposed to be build to take lots of damage. So in order to fix that, I will lower HP con buildings just a tad in order to make them hold the lassat, and make defenses harder just to the point that they will hold on better, and reduce the lassat damage in order to not blow everything up.

Part of it's about damage type. Either way, I recommend not messing with the HP of defenses - they've been very meticulously balanced.

[winsrp]

I recommend not messing with the HP of defenses - they've been very meticulously balanced.

Actually after my 200 change or so to the lassat I finally found the point I want it to be (without changing defenses, structures)... Fully upgraded cyborgs will get their bars all the way to black (1hp), and heavy tanks will go all the way to 40% HP, super heavy tanks get around 60% or so... the impact point is full destruction with a small radius, and the fire radius is wide, but still fits on the screen, most buildings will hold up to 3 hits in a row, (on the burn radius, not the impact point), and defences will need 2 strikes in a row to blow up. Oil derecks blow with a single hit with just burn radius, same as construction units. And has a reload time of 15 mins.

Playing multi in teams, you might be able to clear out a player base with 3 or 4 of these at the same time.

I'm also working in putting this guy further away in researches, making it like, the last thing that can be done. Will need last research facility, last sensor, last engineering, and all super structures researches or something like that. So when you have played a game for around 3/4 hours, and you got to the point that it has gone too far, then you have this weapon to give you an edge and win once and for all (you will still need quite an army to win, but enemy defenses/army are going to be hurt, plus the hole you can make with the initial blast to open you an entry point.), So no more changes in the lassat damage until public deployment of the mod.

Now with the EMP, I'm still changing it, specially in reload time since the weapon now is really useful actually, and I do want it to be a army delayer, and not an army stopper. also EMP planes are quite useful now. They have 3 charges but do reload 3 times slower than EMP cannon/mortar, and EMP weapons all together are not quite expensive since they are really useful.

Vtol strike tower + EMP planes, are now a great combination, but they are probably the most expensive weapons in the game (even a crappy plane with EMP costs more than 1500 power) since 10 of these planes do stop a large part of an army, and of course need huge time to reload. I'm still working in making it also slower to produce, but I'm not so sure if this is related to total cost or is there a time multiplier I can change to make them slow to produce, advice on this is greatly appreciated.

As for bombs for planes, I have still to make some serious test since AI does not helps me much here, all they do is lancer/scourge planes and not bombs, can someone provide me a map so I can test this, a map filled with enemy AA? 3 different sites further away each other so they don't interfere with testing, so I can make some planes and test out AA/Plane damage.

As for batteries, I have changed the Rocket Battery and the Seraph to small range (a little longer than stock but still small), I have made some tests and I thing I can make them a little better here and there.

As for radars I have reduced the range of the Wide spectrum sensor since its an all rounder sensor, and level the range of all other sensor with a greater range WSS has like 2 or 4 less range than specific radars don't remember right now.

I think that after the AA test and calibration I will release beta 1 of the mod.

Cheers - Wins

[winsrp]

Before I try it... can the following be accomplished with the research result functions

Research A... Machine gun

Research B,... Machine gun bullets Iron(+ damage)

Research C ... Machine gun bullets coper (+ damage)

Research B and C, both have a pre-requirement of Research A, so when research A is done , bot B and C become available

Now, Research B gives +5% damage, and research C gives +10% damage.

If i research first B I get +5%, and if then i research C then i get +10% = +15% overall.

So in the research function can i add just a increase percentage in relative amount, or i have to put a total amount, first 105%, then 115%, and I have to make them linear (to make research C I first have to complete B)?

[Zarel]

No, that's not possible. And that's the kind of balance that makes the game more annoying, not more fun.

[winsrp]

No, that's not possible.

Too bad.

And that's the kind of balance that makes the game more annoying, not more fun.

lol, I know, it was just an example of a simple case for something else I wanted to do.

I want to split research trees, So for example, when you get you reseach module, then you get (for example) 4 Research facility upgrades, they won't give you any speed boost, they will only enable technology trees.

So you will get:

AA advanced research (After this you will start on the researches for AA, give you the first AA model)
Missile advanced research (you will get lancer)
Artillery advanced research (you get mortar)
Construction Materials advanced research (you start with the first wall, and buildings upgrades)
etc...

Each of them will have certain touch points, as of you wont be able to build storm bringer with out the lasers of course and stuff like that, but will give you good idea where are you going. Every now and then you will have to advance to the next research point i.e. Artillery advanced research Mk2, or something like that, where you start building upgrades for the next gen weapons... i.e. when mini pod upgrades no longer work for missiles.

Just an idea I have mature a little bit more... will do some excel tries on making such a research tree.

[Zarel]

That's also one of the balance things that would make the game more annoying, not more fun.

Factions make sense because each faction would have a weapon for each niche. What you're proposing is to lock off one niche if you go for another, which would just make the game less fun.

[winsrp]

Well no, I'm not locking anything just sorting it differently.

You will still be able to do all the same researches in the game as usual but you will have to open up a niche with a research upgrade, and some further research options open up as you finish previews ones.

example.... when you finish the first round of cannons, you get Artillery, when you finish rockets you get missiles, when you finish both artillery and missiles you get long range arty... etc etc... its like making up a puzzle, but not as complicated as it is now...

And I want to picture another example...

Engineering -> Fuel Injection Engine -> Power Module

Cool, so I should be able to follow the same formula (Engineering + Engine) to get more power upgrades (with maybe a research requirement every now and then)

So I go, and make Fuel Injection Engine Mk2... no power upgrade.... ok I'll make the next one... Fuel Injection Engine Mk3.... no power upgrades.... crap... ok one more.. Turbo-Charged Engine..... oh come on, where is my power upgrade... Turbo-Charged Engine Mk2... Turbo-Charged Engine Mk3... Gas Turbine Engine... Gas Turbine Engine Mk2... Gas Turbine Engine Mk3... WTF!!! where is my power upgrade

OK I do know that it is a little exaggerated, since by Dedicated Synaptic Link Data Analysis, you will start getting power upgrades like crazy, but is was just to picture that it should follow a pattern in order to be called a research tree, you can't just mix and match everything with every other and call it a day.

What I will do is start forming patterns that people can follow to achieve about the same things, so they don't have to worry about 1/2 a million upgrades that they don't care about to get what they want. BUT, since all excesses are bad, we can't make it that by the start of the game they will get lasers and plasma cannons I do know that.

So I have separated the weapons in the game classes given their upgrades families:

Machine guns
Cannon
Flame
Rocket
Command
AA Gun
Mortars
Slow Rocket
Bomb
Howitzers
Missile
Energy
EMP
Electronic
Gauss
Las Sat

And of course you have Engineering upgrades

Structures
Repair
Defenses
Bodies
Propulsions
Cyborgs

And finally sensors upgrades

Sensors

I would love to change the initial configuration of the 3 (machine gun/engineering/sensor) and remove sensor and put something like research facility upgrade instead (not a research module, just an upgrade that will open up sensors and other misc research upgrades) Called "Systems"

So I will see what I can come up with..

[winsrp]

hi, can a dev tell me why is this mod not loading? stderr comes clean, no errors, but the app just closes when I try to create a new skirmish game.

Thanks.

wins_balance.wz

[TVR]

... it should follow a pattern in order to be called a research tree, you can't just mix and match everything with every other and call it a day. ...

Warzone 2100 was never designed to have a single research tree, only self-contained trees based on technology recovered.

MP design never factored in the consequences of knitting together all those self-contained trees, thus it is almost an entirely different game.

[winsrp]

MP design never factored in the consequences of knitting together all those self-contained trees, thus it is almost an entirely different game.

Well you will feel a third game after I'm finish with this little guy here.... If I'm able to get it working, still do not understand what is going on here.... weird.

[Zarel]

Warzone 2100 was never designed to have a single research tree, only self-contained trees based on technology recovered.

MP design never factored in the consequences of knitting together all those self-contained trees, thus it is almost an entirely different game.

The original game still came with an MP mode (restricted to T1), and I think it was designed concurrently. Have you talked to Pumpkin devs who suggest otherwise?

[winsrp]

Zarel, would you be so kind of take a look to the mod on debug mode, it just crashes out of nothing, and I don't see what is wrong, I know it has to be related to researches, but I don't see the error, those files are auto generated by my tool.

Regards,

Wins

[TVR]

... The original game still came with an MP mode (restricted to T1), and I think it was designed concurrently. ...

I infer all research topics were created for the 30 mission campaign first, as 400 research topics, arranged in a confounding manner for new players, is bad MP game design.

[winsrp]

I think we went a little bit of topic here...

[Zarel]

Crash in:

data.c:512 bufferRSTRREQLoad
frameresource.c:464 resLoadFile
resource_parser.y:117 res_parse

never |12:31:11: [res_parse] file: RSTRREQ researchstruct.txt
wz |12:31:11: [openLoadFile] Reading...[directory: /Users/zarel/Library/Application Support/Warzone 2100 2.2/mods/global/wins_balance.wz] stats/research/multiplayer/researchstruct.txt
Bus error

There's probably a column in research.txt that should have only one 1, but doesn't.

Oh, here's your problem:

research.txt:
R-Defense-Tower01,Level One,0,0,IMAGE_RES_DEFENCE,0,0,RES_TOWER1,GuardTower1,0,0,600,1,1,0,0,0,1,0,0

researchstruct.txt:
R-Defense-Tower01,A0CommandCentre,0

I've reddened a 0. You're telling Warzone that MG Tower has 0 structure prerequisites, and that its structure prereqisite is CC. Of course it crashed. o_O