Dedicated Airceaft Bodies

[Molotov]

I had an idea for a dedicated Fighter model/body set. You could still have your vengeance scourge/scourge VTOLS, but the other player that researched fighter bodies once he got his VTOLs will have faster fighters with a bit higher weapons load and a cooler look (Imagine four Raptor look-alikes knocking a bug/lancer squadron out of the air)Also, it would go a long way to making heavy bombers more useful, not to mention fixing the power-to-weight ratio problem that comes with trying to strap wings on a tank chassis that was the underlying cause of the speed drop as you used heavier components.

Fighter bodies (And RL fighters to base their look on):
Project Fighter (F-35-like design, but not quite as clean and sleek, more fitting to the "flavor" of Project body design)
NP Fighter (Pick a MiG, any MiG)
Nexus Fighter (Su-47?)

Fighter-Bomber Bodies:
Project Fighter-Bomber (Phantom probably, but remember that these are simply GUIDES to the general shape of the body, not a template set in stone)
NP Fighter-Bomber (Harrier)
Nexus Fighter-Bomber (Su:25)

Bomber bodies:
NOTE: This is the only category I deviate from the pattern so far, as there are a number of ways bombers can be used.
Also, RL bomber design is pretty much uniform across the board. So, just think of aircraft that look like Aardvarks, B1B Lancers, and the such, probably a flying wing for the Nexus Heavy. But this is the category where we would need a bit more creativity. The main reason for even having this category is so that using the heavier bomb bays becomes a more feasible and cost-effective option. (Don't tell me you've never wished HEAP bombers had the speed to do anything other than extremely close-in defense)

I know modeling tends to be a problem, but I'm actually starting to get into modeling myself. I don't have a copy of blender yet, but until I get my hands on it i'm making do with the EXTREMELY easy-to-use Sketchup released by Google. If it seems like a good idea, I myself will actually start working on some example models, but don't expect a miracle. My plan for the models is to simply model the chassis completely and use a null mosel in the propulsion section.

On a side note, the weapons for the specialised aircraft will have to be researched, aside from the bombs as they are already implemented. The fighters would be the only category actually affected by this, but I think we should add Air-To-Air missiles for the VTOL's, with slightly better performance/less speed reduction for the dedicated chassis. These would look basically like the scourge type launchers but raised and recessed so they appear to be wing or fuselage-mounted on hard-points, to give them a more fighter-like feel.


On a slightly related note, we should also add a sensor specifically for detecting and targeting incoming VTOL's, paying special attention to VTOL's using it, by targeting multiple incoming VTOLs and dividing up those targets among the assigned units, making the task of using VTOL's as interceptor aircraft much easier, as you could have some assigned to the "air-raid" sensor, and others (probably your fighter-bombers and bombers) assigned to a wide-spectrum sensor to hit incoming ground targets. Personally, I think the sensor is a much more realistic (and much more likeley to be taken seriously as a suggestion) idea.

[fisk0]

Yeah, a few more VTOL bodies would be good. Some of the current ones reminds me of the descriptions of the alien space ships in The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy. Flying bricks (of course, I'm sure I remember the description incorrectly, since I haven't read the book in 13 years).

The Bug, Viper, Leopard and a few other bodies already fit pretty well to the VTOL propulsion, but other's look like they should never be able to take off (even though I guess VTOL's wouldn't need the same aerodynamic designs as regular aircraft would need. With strong enough engines I guess you could make anything fly).

[Molotov]

With strong enough engines I guess you could make anything fly.

F-4 Phantom II, anyone?

But anyway, the biggest problem with the current bodies for VTOL use is, in order to have flight, you must produce alot of power in a lightweight package. The heavier bodies produce alot of power but are way too heavy, which is why the bombers are useless. The biggest help this would be in would be making heavy bombers an actually useful weapon. Additionally, I just think the Air-raid sensor is simply a good idea, and would make the fighter bodies that much more useful.

[Alpha93]

Add chaffs to Bomber Bodies?

[Olrox]

I really think that it would be very nice to see fighters functioning like cyborgs. you have no "design" stage, you research it then it's ready to build. This way, we could get them to have built-in weapons, wing-mounted missile lauchers etc. In my opinion, what looks weird in the current VTOLs is that there's a turret on it. Flying vehicles with turrets only look god while they're on space, having no problem with aerodynamcis, propelled by Xenon Ion thrusters, and with ion cannons.
like THAT.

However, we've got gravity and atmosphere down here, so we do care about aerodynamics.

Making them to work as an entire unit (no modular design, like tanks), the weapons can be integrated into the body, allowing for the aircraft-look we are searching for. And I'm a modeller, I could help with something, if you want.

[fisk0]

I really think that it would be very nice to see fighters functioning like cyborgs. you have no "design" stage, you research it then it's ready to build. This way, we could get them to have built-in weapons, wing-mounted missile lauchers etc. In my opinion, what looks weird in the current VTOLs is that there's a turret on it. Flying vehicles with turrets only look god while they're on space, having no problem with aerodynamcis, propelled by Xenon Ion thrusters, and with ion cannons.
like THAT.

However, we've got gravity and atmosphere down here, so we do care about aerodynamics.

Making them to work as an entire unit (no modular design, like tanks), the weapons can be integrated into the body, allowing for the aircraft-look we are searching for. And I'm a modeller, I could help with something, if you want.

Bombers with bomb bay and machinegun turrets gives good WWII vibes though.

[Olrox]

Bombers with bomb bay and machinegun turrets gives good WWII vibes though.

well, maybe smaller turrets, but the current ones are too big, in my opinion.
Also, the machinegun itself seems a bit misproportioned, it says that it's a 7.62mm gun, but the barrel is a bit too big for that caliber. For comparison, we could take a look at the scavengers from the campaign. 7.62 weapons are usually firearms, light machineguns, carried by infantry. But I really don't expect that to be changed, just take a comment.

[Olrox]

and I think they could be as sleek as this one, but not big.

Aircraft chaingun turret

[whippersnapper]

I really think that it would be very nice to see fighters functioning like cyborgs. you have no "design" stage, you research it then it's ready to build. This way, we could get them to have built-in weapons, wing-mounted missile lauchers etc. In my opinion, what looks weird in the current VTOLs is that there's a turret on it. Flying vehicles with turrets only look god while they're on space, having no problem with aerodynamcis, propelled by Xenon Ion thrusters, and with ion cannons.
like THAT.

However, we've got gravity and atmosphere down here, so we do care about aerodynamics.

indeed. right on the money.

Making them to work as an entire unit (no modular design, like tanks), the weapons can be integrated into the body, allowing for the aircraft-look we are searching for. And I'm a modeller, I could help with something, if you want.

imho... the best strategy for implementing.

like your Gatling gun model. would go well with bombers as in WW2. maybe something sleeker
for fighters.

[Molotov]

My biggest qualm right now is the speed reduction for the bigger bomb bays you can have. Currently, I've been experimenting with "fighter-bombers" using lancers/tank-killers with a bomb bay on one unit. It seems to work well, but it feels like I'm exploiting a glitch in the dual-turret feature. However, no matter how effective a VTOL you build, nothing can save it when the AI decides to draw it out with tanks and then hit it with it's own VTOLs on the re-arming pad.

[Olrox]

I've once managed to blow up an entire T2 AI base with a single strike with a wing of 15 HPV cannon hydra retaliation VTOLs. I was turtling, but as soon as I've got my hands on VTOL, retaliation and HPV cannons, I've sold all my research facilities to make money and built the forementioned VTOLs.

Would be very nice to try some fast-firing cannon also, the fighters would eat any vehicle alive. I've read something about a nose-mounted 40mm gatling gun somewhere, but I don't recall where it was. It would pack a pretty punch, anyway.

[stiv]

Would be very nice to try some fast-firing cannon also, the fighters would eat any vehicle alive. I've read something about a nose-mounted 40mm gatling gun somewhere, but I don't recall where it was. It would pack a pretty punch, anyway.

In the real world, the A-10 "Warthog" uses a 30mm gatling gun with an insane rate-of-fire as a tank buster. Most effective!

[whippersnapper]

wz projectile weaps in no way even reflect todays arms. they are, imho, artificially suppressed to
create a predictable arms race tech tree to pulse lasers on retaliation bodies (esp vtols).

the M312 .50-Caliber (12.7mm) Machine Gun: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... d/m312.htm

combined with Mark 211 .50-caliber Multipurpose Ammunition:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... /mk211.htm

should hold it's own with pulse laser.

but, imho, that's a minor point. they real issue is the very existence of a predominant arms race itself.

[Olrox]

Well, I think the solution of the forementioned problem about the AI counter-attack is to give priority to destroying the enemy VTOLs before, then their factories after that. Then the counter attack would not be the problem with the VTOLs.

I think that bombers should take only anti-infantry weaponry and the bombs bay. Then, you could escort them with some anti-vehicle fighters, with fast-firing cannons only or missiles/rockets only.

[Olrox]

wz projectile weaps in no way even reflect todays arms. they are, imho, artificially suppressed to
create a predictable arms race tech tree to pulse lasers on retaliation bodies (esp vtols).

Yeah, wz2100's weapons are pretty... unconventional.
Mounting single-shot, medium caliber cannons on aircraft sounds very senseless, as the recoil could easily bring the whole plane down to the ground, even if the pilot mantained a vector colinear (but opposite) to the line of fire.
Cannon recoil remembers me of a glitch on GTA: Vice City, where you could drive a tank up to insane speeds (even doing insane stunt bonus, my epic was a twist with a tank, I've managed to do it only once), by aiming the cannon backwards and firing it repeatedly.

But, anyway, a fast-firing, intermediate caliber gun should work well on a fighter.
I was thinking, a scout plane would be also very nice. Tweak it for low speed and hitpoints, but add a very good sight and hability to design artillery weapons, maybe.