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Rman Virgil
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Re: New HQ

Post by Rman Virgil » 06 Oct 2007, 16:20

GrimMoroe wrote: There is no hardcoded limit on this with the source I am working with, you will only be limited by your system specs.  ;)
* Whoa baby !.... & holy blue-fin tuna !!

* When Botman from the German community gets wind of this - my, my,  he will be "sparked" to the max, I think, I hope.

* Not to mention HB (creator of "T-M Linker", "Ariza" maps & tertiles) & shucks, even 4nE may be re-inspired to work his masterful hand again in 32EW & take a break from "Tacticals". Laws 245 too ("Citadel" & "Citadel Elite" creator - maps, tertiles, units, a.i., GFX, etc.).... he's still around.

* I'd best shut-up.... before I get too worked-up over all these wonderous possibilities. :)

- RV :)

* EDIT: After all these years, I must confess I failed to see the extent of the latent potential of re-creating  Urban Feature Set as a "Tipping Point" in WZs future.

* "The Tipping Point" by Malcolm Gladwell (New Yorker staff writer) has been a perennial best seller since 2002 & fully explains my use of the term in a highly engageing fashion (it is related to Viral Marketing & Memetics among other disciplines)..

* You can get a very good overview at Malcolm's site:

http://www.gladwell.com

.........
Last edited by Rman Virgil on 06 Oct 2007, 16:59, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New HQ

Post by Serman » 06 Oct 2007, 16:56

Rman Virgil wrote:
* I think map-makers are gonna be inspired to create dense "City Maps" which will make possible an "Urban Warfare" heretofore not really a part of the WZ play experience.

- RV :)
I've attempted something like that.

I made a map earlier called "Metropolis" with hundreds of buildings among the roads, just like in a huge city that you would find now.

The problem with that is, just like any other scenery item, too many of them next to eachother may create problems.

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Re: New HQ

Post by Rman Virgil » 06 Oct 2007, 17:25

Serman wrote: I've attempted something like that.

I made a map earlier called "Metropolis" with hundreds of buildings among the roads, just like in a huge city that you would find now.

The problem with that is, just like any other scenery item, too many of them next to eachother may create problems.
* Yup... my concern as well. A few post back I mentioned doing some experiments to uncover what I call "Threshold Limits" in placing said features so as to not adversely affect Pathing - meaning as well, Zones & Gateways.

* I also need to determine "Before & After" effects (meaning destructable nature of these features) on pathing of course but also for me, "Fog-of-War" issues ('cause I make use of Player ID assignments to facilitate A.I. pathing as "Attractors", among other things like tactical imbedding.)

* The long & the short of it - these are Map-Maker expertise issues that are largely undocumented. Ergo the reason, & need, to experiment to determine the workable parameters (placement-density) & once uncovered, proceed to document for fledgling map-makers.

- RV :)
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Re: New HQ

Post by Rman Virgil » 06 Oct 2007, 18:00

Serman wrote: I
.......... just like any other scenery item, ........
* Yes, they are a "scenery item" and these play a pivotal role in generating the depth of "Player Immersion" in the game world.... however, in the case of the buildings (as implied in my earlier posts)..... they go way, way, BEYOND just being "scenery"...

* Because of the "Mass" & "Destructable" nature of these building / features you CAN transcend pure scenery AND create-imbed-implement an entirely NEW level of TACTICAL Map Design.

* Think about it....

* Besides "Player Immersion" (esp. with a "Drive" feature fully implemented) we are talking a whole other realm of gameplay heretofore not even explored - I'm talking virgin GPMs and how often can you say that about a game that's 8 years old ?

- RV :)
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Re: New HQ

Post by kage » 06 Oct 2007, 19:12

i think the explosion stuff needs reworking: concrete, drywall, and wood, alone, or in any combination, are not generally explosive -- when a scenery building is destroyed, it'd be a lot cooler to see a wall (cloud) of dust roll out in every direction, and cover everything...  with tweaks to the rendering engine, we could add an option to dynamically paint dust over other textures, such as other buildings, units, etc in the area, and aside from the extra mem usage, performance would only drop, depending on the card/cpu, as those textures are being repainted.

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Re: New HQ

Post by Chojun » 06 Oct 2007, 20:09

:'(  It just makes me cry  :'(
The best thing to do when your philosophies don't stand up to debate is to lock the thread and claim victory.

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Re: New HQ

Post by Kamaze » 06 Oct 2007, 20:36

GrimMoroe, do you use another codebase than the WZRP one?
Or is this just the original, unmodifid WZ version?
We all have the same heaven, but not the same horizon.

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Re: New HQ

Post by Serman » 06 Oct 2007, 21:15

Rman Virgil wrote: * Because of the "Mass" & "Destructable" nature of these building / features you CAN transcend pure scenery AND create-imbed-implement an entirely NEW level of TACTICAL Map Design.

- RV :)
In the map Concrete-T3 (which is my favorite default map)

I have taken tactical advantage of the buildings, and using them to conceal some of my scout/artillery sensor units, which would otherwise be very obvious to the enemy.

Anthony didn't know what hit him, until I showered him with Hellstorm shells. ;)

Also, Grim...

Is the blown-up piece of the building there in the beginning? or does it come off with damage?

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Re: New HQ

Post by Rman Virgil » 06 Oct 2007, 22:26

Serman wrote: In the map Concrete-T3 (which is my favorite default map)

I have taken tactical advantage of the buildings, and using them to conceal some of my scout/artillery sensor units, which would otherwise be very obvious to the enemy.

Anthony didn't know what hit him, until I showered him with Hellstorm shells. ;)


.......
* Yep...you know exactly what I'm talkin 'bout.

* Yet there's much more than LOS to exploit - esp, when building an freature enriched Urban map.

* I'm not sure how well documented it is but you've been making some maps so I'm gonna tell ya here because it's consequences are far-ranging: Resources AND Features AND Baba Structs ARE Player ID assignable in 32EW.....think about how many different things this can effect in-game....when you start experimenting with this upper-most in mind (I'd recommend drawing & documenting what your doing in 32EW 'cause it gets complex real quick when your adhereing to player-position start of game balance & also if you're working with terrain "Asymetries") you will begin to appreciate just HOW much power you have as a Map-Maker-Designer to create-imbed tactical opportunities for players in-game beyond just oil placement AND the positive impact you can have on the OVER-ALL strategic FLOW (think Go-Mo-Ku) across the map.

- RV :)

* EDIT: As far as your "Metropolis" map I would suggest 2 things -

* One: Go back and review your player ID assignments for the buildings (the free-range oil as well) - I bet they are all assigned to one player..

* Two: "Less is more..." hundreds of buildings I'm guessing is well beyond the "Threshhold Limits" esp as regards pathing, etc. (not too mention Player ID assignments not thorughly worked-out & balanced).
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Re: New HQ

Post by DevUrandom » 06 Oct 2007, 23:30

GrimMoroe wrote: There is no hardcoded limit on this with the source I am working with, you will only be limited by your system specs.  ;)
Linked list or realloced array? Or something different?

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Re: New HQ

Post by Rman Virgil » 07 Oct 2007, 01:31

Chojun wrote: :'(  It just makes me cry  :'(
* Yup...a work of art done so well it affects your emotions profoundly, memorably, to the point of bleary-eyed, tears of sheer, nearly over-whelming joy.

* It can be a work of art in any domain: music, literature, painting, theater, dance, cinema, and, yes, even a game can be a work of art on a par with cinema.

* Indeed, in current game design circles this ability to connect to players emotions is a major goal & has been dubbed "Emotioneering". This is an aspiration I thoughly engage in what I do game-wise.

* I've been brought to tears over the years by pieces of music, song, poetry, novels, paintings & sculptures... but, I will here reveal that I'm a total sucker / sap for a well-done Romantic Comedy Movie - they get to me every time. (Recent candidates include "The Lake House" with Keanuu Reaves & Sandy Bullock and "Serendipity" with John Cusack & Kate Bekinsale... 'course it started way back with 'ol chestnuts like "Bringing Up Baby" with Cary Grant & Kate Hepburn.... which also inspired Kate Bosworth's performance in last years "Superman Returns"...)

* Anyway.... this all comes down to one salient point - many peeps connection to Warzone is visceral-emotional and when you see a quality labor of love at work to make the 'ol gal vibrant & sexy again.... well then it can bring-on  real tears of happiness.

- RV :)
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