Does Nexus AI cheat?

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aubergine
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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by aubergine » 19 Feb 2012, 01:21

So, the more I play against Nexus AI, the more I despise its cheating. Giving itself power I can just about cope with, but the tech boosts are just rancid.
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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by NoQ » 19 Feb 2012, 01:46

Ability to properly micromanage droids would be most important thing IMHO?
Replied in the appropriate thread ...

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by Per » 19 Feb 2012, 16:01

Nexus/Semperfi is not supposed to deity-cheat. It will only attack things it has scouted, and actively sends scouts randomly around the map for this purpose.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by aubergine » 20 Feb 2012, 04:58

So, I just allied myself with 1 Nexus AI and we fought against 2 nullbot AIs....

To say Nexus' research cheating was shocking would be an extreme understatement.

It was building VTOL factories before even "Research Module" was available to research. Let me just list some of the pre-requisite research it didn't have before building its VTOL factories:

* Research module
* Synaptic Link Data Analysis; mk2; mk3
* Dedicated Synaptic Link Data Analysis; mk2; mk3
* Improved engineering; Advanced Engineering
* Automated Manufacturing
* Neural Synapse Research Brain; mk2

Seriously, wtf?

It was researching incediary howitzer before howitzers were available to research. Again, literally loads of research skipped.

It's bad enough it cheating on tech, but to leap ahead like that is just laughable. Someone seriously needs to nerf Nexus AI's tech cheating - I'd rather it give itself more power and get ahead that way. Skipping huge sections of the research tree to get ahead is not acceptable IMHO.
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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by NoQ » 20 Feb 2012, 08:21

aubergine wrote:* Research module
* Synaptic Link Data Analysis; mk2; mk3
* Dedicated Synaptic Link Data Analysis; mk2; mk3
* Improved engineering; Advanced Engineering
* Automated Manufacturing
* Neural Synapse Research Brain; mk2
VTOL factories don't require research modules or any of those upgrades, apart from automated manufacturing.
It was researching incediary howitzer before howitzers were available to research. Again, literally loads of research skipped.
That's strange, but i never noticed anything like that. Are you sure you didn't just miss the moment when howitzers were available for research?

Anyway, i don't think it skips researches.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by aubergine » 20 Feb 2012, 12:13

Hrm, looks like another error in my research tree diagram - for some reason I had automated manufacturing requiring advanced engineering (which in turn requires neural research brain mk2, etc).

As for howitzer, I couldn't build howitzers (or ground shakers) and there were none of the howitzer tech items available for research. So it seems that Nexus just sprung the ability to research incendiary howitzer out of nowhere (unless my diagram is wrong again).
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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by Toa » 27 Apr 2012, 16:55

So I just found out today that my good old favorite RTS game WZ2100 went public. Immediately installed it (current beta), and after getting to grips with the controls again by starting the campaign for a while, I decided to fire up a skirmish game on my old favorite map High Grounds.
I figured I may be a bit rusty, but I should be able to do Medium. I went with a high energy game and no starting base (prefer to create my own layout). I was surprised to find the AI already having expanded out onto the oil wells in front of my base, but managed to pick them off and expand that far. But only as far as the narrow stone bridge. I held it for a while, but eventually the AI got the better of me.

I figured, well, maybe I'm more rusty than I care to admit and decided to start another game with the easy AI. I didn't even get to the stone bridge this time around because I got rushed like no tomorrow. So I figured I might tone it down to medium energy to maybe slow the AI's development somewhat - but no dice. In two further games I got rushed and obliberated by the AI in no time. Slightly frustrated I left it at that and decided to check the forums if I just suck that bad (not a hardcore RTS player), or if the AI has really become this hard.

Is "Semperfi" the old AI? Maybe I should give that a try, because I remember the games being much more relaxed.

(In other news: Great job bringing the game back and making it run on modern machines! But that's praise for another thread another time, I guess. :))

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by NoQ » 28 Apr 2012, 06:32

No, Semperfi is an attempt of even further modifications. Try Nexus on easy to see it non-cheating (almost). I'm also sure that the AI was improved in several ways during last years. Semperfi disregards difficulty levels, so it is non-cheating on all difficulties.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by Toa » 29 Apr 2012, 16:24

NoQ wrote:Try Nexus on easy to see it non-cheating (almost).
As mentioned above, I did - and it turned out to be even harder than the Normal setting.

Tried an Semperfi on an Easy setting now and it was a cakewalk - plays much more like the AI that I remember.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by NoQ » 30 Apr 2012, 07:12

Also note that both Nexus and Semperfi have two research branches and pick randomly one of them, playing much weaker on the second one (VTOL branch, designed to get VTOLs early).

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by NoQ » 26 Jun 2012, 10:40

Just noticed that in 3.1_beta11 Nexus AI no longer power-cheats. Still research-cheats though.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by zydonk » 26 Jun 2012, 12:15

Toa wrote:So I just found out today that my good old favorite RTS game WZ2100 went public. Immediately installed it (current beta), and after getting to grips with the controls again by starting the campaign for a while, I decided to fire up a skirmish game on my old favorite map High Grounds.
I figured I may be a bit rusty, but I should be able to do Medium. I went with a high energy game and no starting base (prefer to create my own layout). I was surprised to find the AI already having expanded out onto the oil wells in front of my base, but managed to pick them off and expand that far. But only as far as the narrow stone bridge. I held it for a while, but eventually the AI got the better of me.

I figured, well, maybe I'm more rusty than I care to admit and decided to start another game with the easy AI. I didn't even get to the stone bridge this time around because I got rushed like no tomorrow. So I figured I might tone it down to medium energy to maybe slow the AI's development somewhat - but no dice. In two further games I got rushed and obliberated by the AI in no time. Slightly frustrated I left it at that and decided to check the forums if I just suck that bad (not a hardcore RTS player), or if the AI has really become this hard.

Is "Semperfi" the old AI? Maybe I should give that a try, because I remember the games being much more relaxed.

(In other news: Great job bringing the game back and making it run on modern machines! But that's praise for another thread another time, I guess. :))
You could try WZ v2.3.9. It comes with a number of mods, one of which is the original 1.10 version (ie, the final Pumpkin patch). That gives a game close to the CD installation.

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Re: Does Nexus AI cheat?

Post by Death_To_Dunces » 13 Aug 2012, 07:04

Whenever I play I have noticed that the AI can get more units than the 150 unit max. Then I have the weird cyborg engineer bug... I built 18 and then it said "Control Limit Reached". I had 30 other tanks :|Then I have noticed that Archangels can shoot through cliffs if they're close enough...

Back on topic....
I have found the major research cheat myself. I was playing the map "Sk-Wheel" and was allied with Cyan. I was researching as fast as possible, and so was he. Somehow, all the other AI's got the Whirlwind AA before we even had the Hurricane done. Wtf?

Then the massive amounts of power... I have seen the AI's have a constant stream of heavy units leaving their base and still have 100,000 power. It never changed...

I usually give myself Infi-power just to keep up. That and their units also seem to have "Biffer baker" turned on. I can send a mg viper on wheels with full health against on of their MG vipers on wheels and mine will die before theirs.

Cyborgs are really badly balanced too. Worthless VS. Defence, Gold Medal winner VS. Units.

Warzone is still an incredible game, and I think Pumpkin Studios did an incredible job doing what nobody has ever done before. Kudos Pumpkin and whoever revived WZ2100!

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