New unit for scavengers

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zamaszysty
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New unit for scavengers

Post by zamaszysty » 26 Dec 2010, 19:48

I was recently thinking about scavengers and how would their tactics etc. look like. Since they are survivors gathering random trash from all arround they don't really have bigger and tougher tanks. How about adding then a unit like a "hijacker" that would snipe selected unit, kill its driver, and so any scavenger infantry that would come in contact with that unit would just take it over "as a new driver".

That of course would be impossible for VTOL and such "sniped" unit would just crash into the ground. I'm not sure houw would the AI act if they ever caugt a builder, because i don't really know if there are separate scripts for normal and scavenger AI, but still ...

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Wibble199
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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Wibble199 » 27 Dec 2010, 20:56

Correct me if I'm wrong but all units are unmanned droids...

Also, this is basically the same as the nexus turret.

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by zamaszysty » 27 Dec 2010, 21:45

Yeah basicaly it's a sort of nexus for scavengers, just with the difference, that there could be some "immobilised units" without ANY user on the map if it happends that scavenger never makes it to "hop on inside" and drive ;)

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Zombie » 27 Dec 2010, 21:58

Wibble199 wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong but all units are unmanned droids...

Also, this is basically the same as the nexus turret.
I'm pretty sure you're wrong. Cyborgs, for example, are people in powered suits (this bit of information is taken from the alpha campaign). Also I'm pretty sure the campaign makes reference to pilots being in the vehicles.

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Wibble199
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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Wibble199 » 28 Dec 2010, 03:37

I thought in alpha campaign you had to get the neural synapse technology, that allowed people to have communication with the computer, and therefore the cyborgs and other droids also.

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Zombie » 28 Dec 2010, 04:15

The neural synapse technology is a computer interface built into one of the vertebrae in the neck of the pilots. It allowed whoever got the implant to use an exosuit as if it was a part of their own body. Hence the term 'Cyborg' used in game. The animation in the Alpha campaign when you get the neural synapse technology explains it pretty well.

To counter your point on another front, if the units in-game were just droids, then wouldn't exp be preserved even if a unit dies? That is, to say, if I lose a unit who was at Hero rank, shouldn't the next unit I produce be a Hero (assuming that they are remote-controlling droids)

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by drgnrdr » 28 Dec 2010, 05:35

Wibble199 wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong but all units are unmanned droids...

Also, this is basically the same as the nexus turret.
Actually it's both, all droid vehicles are capable to be driven if needed. But can be remote controlled when manpower is limited. That's my opinion, this subject has been discussed before and if my memory is correct not resolved. Because each side was adamant about their opinion.

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by NoQ » 28 Dec 2010, 08:50


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Rman Virgil
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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Rman Virgil » 28 Dec 2010, 09:22

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drgnrdr wrote:Actually it's both, all droid vehicles are capable to be driven if needed. But can be remote controlled when manpower is limited. That's my opinion, this subject has been discussed before and if my memory is correct not resolved. Because each side was adamant about their opinion.

drgnrdr
Yea there was that adamant stance displayed on both sides of the debate but in all fairness there was a good deal of evidence to support each position.

That said, I very much like your formulation:
Actually it's both, all droid vehicles are capable to be driven if needed. But can be remote controlled when manpower is limited.
I think that very neatly resolves the ambiguity in the evidence trail.... and, simultaneously, opens the doors to the creation of far richer narrative constructs that can directly manifest in fresh, compelling, game play in ALL modes - CAM, SKI, MP. Thus, your re-conceptualization is generative, and "generative" is what WZ Creators were all about in the game's core design intent AND the community they fostered and encouraged to participate in WZ's game play evolution. :3

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Zombie » 28 Dec 2010, 20:56

Honestly where is the person who came up with this game, they'd know

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Rman Virgil » 29 Dec 2010, 16:32

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Zombie wrote:Honestly where is the person who came up with this game, they'd know
There were several and it was conceived some 13 years ago.

They're around and it would be interesting if one piped-in on the matter some day but, really, I think drgnrdr's generative conceptualization cannot be topped for the reasons stated already. I frankly would be astounded if WZ Creators support for drgnrdr's formulation was not unanimous - it's that fundamentally robust design-wise. :3

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by drgnrdr » 29 Dec 2010, 22:29

There is a kind of proof to my idea. In the Campaign Gamma when you rescue the remnants of Alpha base, if all were manned there would be more than 10 vehicles rescue. if all were automated none would be there. So it has to be both. Also after a nuclear war able bodied personnel would be scarce and valuable because of mutations and diseases.

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by 3drts » 30 Dec 2010, 01:43

I thought the original concept was that the tanks would be droids.
Then droids with a "learning AI" that gained experience (somewhat analogous to Arnold's character in T2, or the Cylon fighters in BSG)
Not remote controlled, if the "mechanical brain" is destroyed, its experience is lost, but the mechanical brain can easily be put in another tank (recycling).

Then it was made ambiguous, or implied they were manned during cutscenes, but the voices could have been of people traveling with the droids. The whole peripheral logistics and living quarters arrangements are not represented in game, so who knows...



As to the suggestion for scavs....
Its never gonna happen, and I don't think it would make for good gameplay.
Could work in a scripted/special single player mission though.

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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Brisingr » 30 Dec 2010, 15:04

:| Erm arnt the vehicles manned at first but slowly become unmanned? and the Cyborgs are either dead guys made into robots or living guys inhanced by robotics? (Biocommando is a cyborg he is living human with robotic inhancements).


So how about this have this hijacker :ninja: for early warfare and then the scavs can have hackers :geek:

also the players can have a early version of that anti Nexus tower tech (Nexus resistents circuits or what ever it is) and it could be called something like security circuits or something.

:ninja: So hijackers for early warfare (1 or 2 for small body, 3 for medium, 4 or 5 for heavy for the number of crew) also they shouldnt be snipers they should be special mercs (look at game Mercenaries 1 & 2 they hijack tanks by climbing on them quick).

:geek: And then theres Hackers (they come about when the scavs start going up agaist automated units or droids in other words) who need to get kind of close to start hacking and the more advance the tech for the player the longer the units will take to be hacked.
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Re: New unit for scavengers

Post by Defacto » 03 Jan 2011, 23:37

Brisingr wrote::| Erm arnt the vehicles manned at first but slowly become unmanned? and the Cyborgs are either dead guys made into robots or living guys inhanced by robotics? (Biocommando is a cyborg he is living human with robotic inhancements).


So how about this have this hijacker :ninja: for early warfare and then the scavs can have hackers :geek:

also the players can have a early version of that anti Nexus tower tech (Nexus resistents circuits or what ever it is) and it could be called something like security circuits or something.

:ninja: So hijackers for early warfare (1 or 2 for small body, 3 for medium, 4 or 5 for heavy for the number of crew) also they shouldnt be snipers they should be special mercs (look at game Mercenaries 1 & 2 they hijack tanks by climbing on them quick).

:geek: And then theres Hackers (they come about when the scavs start going up agaist automated units or droids in other words) who need to get kind of close to start hacking and the more advance the tech for the player the longer the units will take to be hacked.
Nope, the cyborgs in Wz2100 are completely mechanical, but controlled by a human via a synaptic link.

All of the vehicles have windows, which makes it obvious that they are supposed to be human controlled - that doesn't mean that they are.
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