Traps and Waterfalls

Ideas and suggestions for how to improve the Warzone 2100 base game only. Ideas for mods go in Mapping/Modding instead. Read sticky posts first!
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lav_coyote25
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by lav_coyote25 » 01 Aug 2010, 21:23

DTSX wrote:* seppuku was a form of suicide that was meant to retain one's honor after a great dishonor was done to him. Kamikaze was a way of honoring the God emperor, but the reason why I want to both call it Kamikaze and be only a T1 unit is that during the whole Kamikaze attack phase in Japan, many generals were outspoken about the uselessness of it. That they should work maybe until the second or third time, but to continue that idiocy would be a waste of human lives in general.
:shock: wow. some one with a knowledge of history. where you educated from. :hmm:

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Rman Virgil » 01 Aug 2010, 21:47

DTSX wrote:* seppuku was a form of suicide that was meant to retain one's honor after a great dishonor was done to him. Kamikaze was a way of honoring the God emperor, but the reason why I want to both call it Kamikaze and be only a T1 unit is that during the whole Kamikaze attack phase in Japan, many generals were outspoken about the uselessness of it. That they should work maybe until the second or third time, but to continue that idiocy would be a waste of human lives in general.
Yes. I am aware of the diffs and the history of both and can also supplement any gaps in my education with near instantaneous Google searches and primary source refs from my personal library. 8) I too have what I think is a valid rationale (from being informed long, long, long, before this discussion) for using the one term over the other 10 years ago ! - as well I can & have made this stuff many moons past. XD

As well, there are more nuanced distinctions between the 2 terms that have come to the fore over the last 40 years that your account doesnot even touch upon.

Besides, this point was totally incidental to the main thrust of my post which was to answer the questions of whether this was something that could be done as a Mod as opposed to requiring code changes and also it's feasibility. :roll:

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Last edited by Rman Virgil on 01 Aug 2010, 23:32, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by DTSX » 01 Aug 2010, 23:07

As for coding, isn't it just possible to make it act like a mine? Like a range of 1 and has the attack of the howitzers or something, that way it'll blow itself up since it has almost no health... The question here is whether or not they can explode when they die...

Virgil, I studied east asian, roman-european history, and african history at college and high school

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Rman Virgil » 01 Aug 2010, 23:47

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* DTSX: Yes, that can be done.... that's why I recommended using- modifying the Mine files from NTW.

* As for your background - that's cool. Me too. :) I am especially fond of the work of Akutagawa, Tanizaki, Kawabata & Mishima..

But even with decades of study under my belt, I make no claims of being an expert in Japanese cultural history.
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by JDW » 02 Aug 2010, 02:07

DTSX wrote:As I stated before I have no idea on how to code and I have a Crapple, so I can't really go too far into the modding world. The important thing would be that EMP units would render the suicidal unit completely useless and destroy it immediately. I feel that Kamikazi cyborgs would be an early shock unit at best. Faced against Heavy Cannons and stuff like that would render these cyborgs useless. It'll be a fun tech to have after, let's say, mortars are introduced.
I'm sorry if I wasn't very supportive at first. But now I see that this really could be an interesting feature. But even if it's not, it doesn't matter. Because showcasing it as a mod would be a good learning experience for you.

If you need help with something, you could always ask around. There are guys like KukY, Black Project, who are actively modding, and would surely guide you.

And like RV said, it's possible. Heck, nothing's impossible if you're positive and confident. Good luck to you if you do think about trying this.
Last edited by JDW on 02 Aug 2010, 02:51, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Roux Le Corps » 02 Aug 2010, 02:08

good to see you supporting the suicide units ^_^
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Rman Virgil » 02 Aug 2010, 02:43

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All the really hard work was done for Mod v.1.12 which are the files NTW uses. To make Suicide Borgs would fall to some simple .txt editing of those files & then the proper mod package.

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by DTSX » 02 Aug 2010, 04:29

Actually, I feel bad that I basically hijacked this thread and pissed over the OP's body, but is there anyone who can show me the ropes to modding with macs? I want to implement my unstable insanity into this game.

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Rman Virgil » 02 Aug 2010, 06:17

DTSX wrote:Actually, I feel bad that I basically hijacked this thread and pissed over the OP's body, but is there anyone who can show me the ropes to modding with macs? I want to implement my unstable insanity into this game.
First make sure mines are implemented still in NTW which is distributed with the game as a Mod and the following wiki page will explain how to find and run it on a Mac:

http://guide.wz2100.net/faq

Assuming the they are still there (you can always get them from Delphinio if not) then you should familiarize yourself with .txt editing at the following link:

http://developer.wz2100.net/wiki/TxtEditing

From there you can open the NTW Mod, identify all the Mine Files, take the ones you are gonna use out of NTW while maintaining the same file structure and proceed to edit the appropriate value files.

Last - repackage as your Suicide Borg Mod.

It'll will take patience and attention to detail when it comes to playing with numbers more than anything and it helps if your comfortable with DBs and spread sheets like Excel. What I have found with this type of modding is that many bright folks are just not temperamentally suited to it, not that it's inherently hard or esoteric, and that makes a big difference in being able to learn it and do it, There was a time when I would enjoy playing around with this stuff but I honestly no longer have that sensibility so I stay away from it because it feels more like an unpleasant, headache inducing chore, than fun.

- RV :cool:

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Last edited by Rman Virgil on 02 Aug 2010, 14:38, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by noccy » 02 Aug 2010, 06:48

I must say the entire mine idea is interesting as it might make you think twice before rushing another player 5 minutes into the game. Just finished a 6 hour AI skirmish, so personally I'm a fan of longer "deeper" games -- perhaps not 6 hours, but definitely more than 5 minutes.

Being able to scatter mines at an early stage of the game and making a dedicated sweeper/sensor turret as described earlier in this thread (like a gigantic rake) available after a bit of research definitely sounds like a good idea. As upgrades are researched, the early mines wouldn't do too much damage further down the game, but it would make the game a bit more interesting :)

Thinking out loud, an option to toggle multiplayer mods would be the ultimate solution to the problem, just like how mutators are implemented in FPS games such as nexuiz and unreal tournament. If you want the mines, enable the mines.

About the waterfall idea: I love it. If it can be implemented it would definitely provide some additional eyecandy. The game already looks pretty good, the changes in 3.0 looks even better. Actually, the only thing still poking me in the eye with 3.0 are the tree models but I have read a few of the technical discussions about the models and I understand if this is hard to implement :)
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by JDW » 02 Aug 2010, 11:17

DTSX wrote:... is there anyone who can show me the ropes to modding with macs? I want to implement my unstable insanity into this game.
Me thinks the Mapping/Modding section would be your best bet to finding help/solutions to hurdles. Open a new topic and ask away. :lecture:

@ RV: I thought that you weren't actively involved in the latest development any longer. But I'm glad that you still remember a lot of what was in the original code, because your experience is really valuable to us newbies at times like this. :D
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Rman Virgil » 02 Aug 2010, 18:31

j0shdrunk0nwar wrote:
@ RV: I thought that you weren't actively involved in the latest development any longer. But I'm glad that you still remember a lot of what was in the original code, because your experience is really valuable to us newbies at times like this. :D
True, though I try to keep up so I can stick to lines most promising in what I still have a passion to work on. As long as I read posts it's hard not to share, deliberately picking occasional spots, what I know that could be helpful to those who have a creative vision & the ambition to explore it by making something new to play with. XD That said, I mostly try to stay out of the way & only respond to a small fraction of what I read and have a POV on (like maybe 5%).

- Regards, RV :D

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Claydoe » 02 Aug 2010, 20:26

DTSX wrote:Actually, I feel bad that I basically hijacked this thread and pissed over the OP's body, but is there anyone who can show me the ropes to modding with macs? I want to implement my unstable insanity into this game.
LMAO!!! :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:
NO NO NO!!! I liked where this is going! Going from mines to Cyborg Bombers (With some history lessons) :lecture: , is awesome!
Means my ideas sparked ideas in other people! :P
noccy wrote:About the waterfall idea: I love it. If it can be implemented it would definitely provide some additional eyecandy. The game already looks pretty good, the changes in 3.0 looks even better. Actually, the only thing still poking me in the eye with 3.0 are the tree models but I have read a few of the technical discussions about the models and I understand if this is hard to implement :)
I agree. Some of the simple models could be cleaned up a bit... :hmm:
Is there anyone that can build on this idea? Id like to help in any way that I can! :)
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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Luigi » 03 Aug 2010, 07:50

These mines would be possible to be built or just put it for a turret?
I'M NOT A CHEATER!!!!

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Re: Traps and Waterfalls

Post by Roux Le Corps » 03 Aug 2010, 14:50

mines would be built from specialized tank i assume ?
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