I hate ripples

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RBL-WARDOG
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by RBL-WARDOG » 01 Oct 2010, 17:07

hao wrote:Everyone, i guess. Same as any other mod. Did not test it though (:
the limits mod is a mod that only the host must have in, it's the mod that will allow you to have something like 12 research centers and 15 power gens.
the arrty limit mod i have never tried, but it may be that only the host has to have it. try it and find out, the worst that will happen is it doesn't launch.
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by 3drts » 03 Oct 2010, 11:35

the problem with ripples, is they outrange everything aside from Archangels, and they are available before everything(in terms of artillery) but mortars.

The other problem is that it uses the direct fire upgrade class, so you don't have to divert research to upgrade artillery, as you must do with howitzers - along the way teching to scourge, you get powerful artillery "for free", you get no such benefit teching to railguns.
But then cannon AA was added, so it was a choice between artillery "for free", or "aa for free", but AA rockets were added as well...

This means once an artillery war starts, it is hard to turn the tide with anything other than building ripples faster than the enemy.
The only pre-archangel artillery that can compete, is groundshaker, which means a diversion of research (not so important on 3-4 layer teams, very important for single players with only 5 facilities)

If the player spaces out their ripples (requires closer management of artillery construction), Groundshakers don't compete nearly as well, and the enemy can always "fall back" and build ripples in range of the closest enemy GSs, but safely out of CB range fire, and then move the ripple lines closer, pushing the enemy artillery back a few tiles at a time.

Additionally, you can build ripples just barely in range of the enemy defensive line, allowing you to bombard it without taking howitzer CB fire.
It seems the only viable way, is ceasing all artillery fire, and building a forward Howitzer base (like on NTW with cyb transports), which leaves your defensive line vulerable to bombardment, and a subsequent tank+cyborg attack for too long for my tastes.

Now that mini-rockets as a weapon class are gone, I suggest adding an artillery rocket class, and having ripples use upgrades for that.

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Re: I hate <insert weapon here>

Post by TVR » 04 Oct 2010, 07:32

Lancers, Heavy Cannons, Flamers, Machine Gun Towers, Fortresses, now Rocket Artillery.

Rocket Artillery are THE artillery superiority weapons, of course, this makes it effective against itself.

But is it really that difficult to send some tracked cannon tanks to take out a stationary artillery position?

You could even use that nifty sensor detector turret to take out all those pesky spotters...

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Zarel
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by Zarel » 04 Oct 2010, 08:38

ECM will make using tracked tanks a lot more effective. One day... :|

I wish there were some sort of unit mount that could make a unit immune/invisible to artillery. We could give that ability to Collective bodies. No one would ever use anything else! XD

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by alto1234 » 04 Oct 2010, 14:44

ripple races only occur when both players have money to burn, e.g. high oil. a ripple battery deals high structural damage for high cost. mathematically speaking, the usefulness of ripples varies directly as the distance between bases and the amount of power available. with great distance between bases and with ample power supply, there is no reason not to construct ripples. however, on maps designed intelligently with terrain, e.g. standard oil, sensors can't see around corners and one thus cannot possibly preempt every attack with expensive artillery batteries. have i seen ripples in standard oil? definitely. are they nearly as effective as people claim? definitely not.

the nature of high oil defines it as prone to spamming of anything useful to gain an advantage. ripples, hmgs, vtols... if you do not like spam, learn how to play real maps where economy is actually part of the game. :stare:

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by macuser » 06 Oct 2010, 14:29

Hmm this is just another ideal reason for my factions mod :) . if each player had a special unit that had an advantage they would "spam" it (because it has an advantage) and then everyone would not be spamming the same unit. Voila!

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by Rade » 17 Oct 2010, 20:06

Zarel wrote:ECM will make using tracked tanks a lot more effective. One day... :|

I wish there were some sort of unit mount that could make a unit immune/invisible to artillery. We could give that ability to Collective bodies. No one would ever use anything else! XD
How about a new laser turret which would be able to track and shot down incoming artillery shells and rockets.

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by NoQ » 18 Oct 2010, 06:27


Rade
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by Rade » 18 Oct 2010, 11:23

I've seen it but only after I posted this.

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by zarulhairee » 18 Oct 2010, 15:04

i think i can make a concept model regarding anti-missile system.but my concept of it that it can only kill 1 missile at a time and have to be recharge. but just take short period of time like another 2-3 seconds
ENEMY OF ENEMY WITHIN ENEMY THAT LIES BETWEEN ENEMY THAT TRIES TO UNFOLD AN ENEMY SO THAT THE ENEMY WILL THINK IT'S ENEMY IS AWAY FROM THE ENEMY HOME WORLD THEN AFTER THE ENEMY WORLD

wanna add me on Google talk? go ahead :D

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by ortmaster » 02 Nov 2010, 17:37

Rade wrote:
Zarel wrote:ECM will make using tracked tanks a lot more effective. One day... :|

I wish there were some sort of unit mount that could make a unit immune/invisible to artillery. We could give that ability to Collective bodies. No one would ever use anything else! XD
How about a new laser turret which would be able to track and shot down incoming artillery shells and rockets.
that sounds awesome, wasn't the name of that anti scud missile called the patriot missile that usa used in desert storm, that is what we need

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by WarTux » 03 Nov 2010, 04:58

Honestly, ripples (and any form of artillery) can be quite easily countered on a high-quality, well-balanced map (i.e. anything but NTW). :stare:

Okay, so NTW is THE most popular way to play, but nonetheless artillery still has a counter- VTOLs. If you're playing no VTOL games, then you've just eliminated a highly powerful weapon that is part of the balance of the game. (And heck, almost all of these games are played on super-high oil maps, which removes yet another part of the balance of the game.)
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by Cat Cranker » 03 Nov 2010, 05:14

Honestally this subject is really been beat tha snot out of and idk do people not understand the concept of why they have this problem and how you can fix this problem....ill help dont play high oil maps and u will be peachy ;)
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Re: I hate ripples

Post by 3drts » 04 Nov 2010, 17:41

Then they'll whine about getting mg rushed.

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Re: I hate ripples

Post by Defacto » 18 Nov 2010, 17:11

I loved ripples until the day when i came to the campaign mission where your enemys use the ripples from the other side of the base before you unlock them... now i suddenly don't like them anymore... :lol2:


yep ripples do = total dis-satisfaction. :stressed: :annoyed: :x :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: :lol2: but you get used to it... :lecture: lav_coyote...again apologies for the interruption.
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