Heavy Cannons

[Firechkn34]

Hey, Does anybody else thin that the Heavy cannon is over powered? Every time i play against AI, i start out alright until the first heavy cannon, python tracked tank shows up and wrecks half my base. Personally i think they do too much damage and have too many HPs.What do you guys think?

[Lancefighter]

nope.

Half the time i dont even bother researching HC - its just not useful. focus research like such: one always research improvements, one focus on power stuff (better generators or veh speed) then split the rest between machienguns, antitank guns, and veh armor)

Generally, youll want to at least have lancers by the time the bad guys have heavy cannons.
Either that, or cyborgs with minirockets should take care of it. heavy cannons dont have enough rate of fire to kill cyborgs

[Zarel]

lol. This is like the fifth thread saying some weapon's overpowered, and not once has it been the same weapon. It's especially hilarious with flamers - I've had people tell me they're overpowered, and I've had people tell me they're underpowered.

Anyway, about HCs, they're really not. You can micro them to death with TKs, or spam infernos/thermite flamers. I can't imagine AI HC's being a threat unless you've been specializing in only artillery or MGs (For artillery: Your second specialization should really be something that does well against tracks, considering that's artillery's primary weakness. For MG: There is something wrong if you haven't won by the time the AI gets HCs. Also, your second specialization should be something that does better against tracks).

[Lancefighter]

s. I can't imagine AI HC's being a threat unless you've been specializing in ... MGs..

but MGs are awesome
okok, i just prefer having 'the right weapon for the job' instead of 'the weapon for every job'

[Firechkn34]

i have problems with them taking out my defenses. I counted and one HC python tracked tank fires 7 shots (assuming full upgrades) and can take out a HPV or MC Hardpoint, it takes atleast 15 shells of HPV to take it out, that i was makes it over powered in my eyes. AND it only takes like 3 sells to take out a machinegun bunker. I just think the tanks get too much HPs with HC attached.

Ex. 6 MC Hardpoints ( Plastee Mk2) vs. one Tiger HC track. 28 secs, 63% damage on tank, 0 hardpoints remaining...

[psychopompos]

plasma cannons

you know what im saying

anyway, defences shouldnt by that tough in a game like this, all you get is turtles otherwise
lancer viper(or scorp) half track are good for dealing with this threat in support of standing defences.
unless the balance has changed again.

[Zarel]

but MGs are awesome

Yeah, I know, that's why I said that if you were using MGs, the AI should be dead before it can get HCs.

i have problems with them taking out my defenses. I counted and one HC python tracked tank fires 7 shots (assuming full upgrades) and can take out a HPV or MC Hardpoint, it takes atleast 15 shells of HPV to take it out, that i was makes it over powered in my eyes. AND it only takes like 3 sells to take out a machinegun bunker. I just think the tanks get too much HPs with HC attached.

Yes, HC is more powerful than HPV. That's why HC is more expensive, harder to research, heavier, slower to move, slower to reload, can't hit air, and has lower range than HPV.

In other news, Scourge Missile is more powerful than Lancer.

Ex. 6 MC Hardpoints ( Plastee Mk2) vs. one Tiger HC track. 28 secs, 63% damage on tank, 0 hardpoints remaining...

Dude, it was a Tiger. By the time AIs get Tigers, you should have Scourge missiles and railguns.

[Firechkn34]

um yeah right, I can't manage to stay alive that far. Too many VTOLs and Heavy cannons, And the AI focus on Bodies enough that they get them WAY before i get scourge or railguns. And it is either or, you can't have both Scourge and Railguns Unless you build no tanks and spend money on nothing but research. Even then it's hard.But the HP is what kills me. 3500 for HC compared to like 2700 for scourge if i remember correctly. It's just too much for early in the game.

[Lancefighter]

but MGs are awesome

Yeah, I know, that's why I said that if you were using MGs, the AI should be dead before it can get HCs.

but.. wait.. it didnt say that when i posted my post o.0

[kracker]

Hey, Does anybody else thin that the Heavy cannon is over powered? Every time i play against AI, i start out alright until the first heavy cannon, python tracked tank shows up and wrecks half my base. Personally i think they do too much damage and have too many HPs.What do you guys think?

Just research rockets and use lancers or scourge against them... They are good if you use them correctly.

[Zarel]

um yeah right, I can't manage to stay alive that far. Too many VTOLs and Heavy cannons, And the AI focus on Bodies enough that they get them WAY before i get scourge or railguns. And it is either or, you can't have both Scourge and Railguns Unless you build no tanks and spend money on nothing but research. Even then it's hard.But the HP is what kills me. 3500 for HC compared to like 2700 for scourge if i remember correctly. It's just too much for early in the game.

Dude, what sort of setup are you running? Also, can you play multiplayer? I could just show you how to do it.

[WarTux]

I had the same problem as you (getting overrun by HCs) back when I was... not so good against the AI.

The key is, as Zarel mentioned, to beat or severely hamper the AI before it gets heavy cannons. Obtain and steal as much oil as possible, and if the AI does get heavy cannons, you should have a suitable force to take them out. Remember, the AI can only send HC tanks out about 2-4 at a time due to the fact that those things cost so much. So build up an army of lancer tanks, flamer hovers, cyborg heavy gunners, and cyborg flamers to combat them.

As for your VTOL problem... beat the AI before he gets them or sends them out. (Also, Cyclone/Whirlwind/HPV FTW!)

Hope this helps!

[Dalton]

...scourge if i remember correctly. It's just too much for early in the game.

You call heavy cannon early game , see links below.

DyDo-AI|1v3|Part1
DyDo-AI|1v3|Part2
DyDo-AI|1v3|Part3

(Hint: to beat AI rush them)

[Firechkn34]

You call heavy cannon early game , see links below.

33:26 into the game is when the first HC showed up and knocked down my front door...and living room...and kitchen.

[Zarel]

And the AI focus on Bodies enough that they get them WAY before i get scourge or railguns.

If the AI can research faster than you, you're doing it wrong. What kind of game are you playing? If you're playing a 1v3 comp stomp or something, it's not surprising that the AI is better than you.

And it is either or, you can't have both Scourge and Railguns Unless you build no tanks and spend money on nothing but research.

Either one can handle HCs no problem, though, so it's not like that's an issue.

3500 for HC compared to like 2700 for scourge if i remember correctly. It's just too much for early in the game.

By the way: The mantra of the hit-and-run unit, remember it well:

Your HP doesn't matter if your enemies die before they can hit you.

Scourge's range is approximately twice that of Heavy Cannon. It's also lighter and faster. If a heavy cannon gets close enough to you to shoot at you, you're doing it wrong.

You call heavy cannon early game , see links below.

DyDo-AI|1v3|Part1
DyDo-AI|1v3|Part2
DyDo-AI|1v3|Part3

(Hint: to beat AI rush them)

Your links are for high power maps. So not good for teaching strategy. <_<

33:26 into the game is when the first HC showed up and knocked down my front door...and living room...and kitchen.

Yeah, 33:26 is generally the point at which you have tank killers, thermites, and all those other weapons that HC can't handle.

Come onto IRC, I'll show you how I play: http://wz2100.net/chat/games