Some new cliff-ideas

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montetank
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Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 21 Jan 2015, 19:30

Searching for new clifftiles for the Arizonamaps, because i don`t like the usual cliffs, i change water to cliffs. The result is something like a salt stone or lime stone. The water you can see is tileset 16. I would like to know, if you like it. More smooth? I would like to use the idea in one of the next maps. Perhaps as monoliths in addition with the normal cliffs.

Also not bad in Rocky-maps to use water as cliffs. Looks like a gigantic monolith. I need some new ideas for cliffs-especially in Arizona maps. Very important: How can I improve my English? :lol2:
Thanks for reading.

Regards
Attachments
Monolith (Rocky).jpg
Monolith (Rocky).jpg (70.03 KiB) Viewed 4962 times
Salt stone (Arizona).png
Salt stone (Arizona).png (335.7 KiB) Viewed 4962 times
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NoQ
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by NoQ » 21 Jan 2015, 20:55

I used urban and rockies seabed as cliffs on Toxic and Fresh respectively. Your experiment with arizona seabed looks good, i'd borrow that, it may also probably be great as normal ground. Note that you can also do the opposite: use normal ground as water to obtain various water colors (dirt on rockies makes some nice green lakes, also flooded concrete). I haven't experimented much with other arizona cliffs, apart from the brown ground cliffs which don't look as well on 3.1 as they used to on 2.3.

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 21 Jan 2015, 22:06

Yes-i used the brown cliffs in my trefoil-map. But your right-looks not so good like earlier (8c-justice-i think it is an idea of Rman Virgil) I never had the idea for the opposite-to use normal ground as water :)
Thanks NoQ.
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by NoQ » 21 Jan 2015, 22:21

I never had the idea for the opposite-to use normal ground as water
Well you must have seen this one.

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 22 Jan 2015, 02:42

NoQ wrote: Well you must have seen this one.
Great. I just create this: The result of changing water into sand, is something “white”. Could be a salt dessert or better –snow like in Flagstaff/Arizona. But the best: I changed clifftile 71 into water and the result is, that the mountains are reflected in the water. Looks great in game, when the water is moving. The normal water between the snow/salt and the reflection is tile 16. I will make a map tommorow :D
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2c-test.wz
(6.22 KiB) Downloaded 123 times
texture.png
texture.png (429.45 KiB) Viewed 4911 times
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 23 Jan 2015, 20:00

Map is in work and looks fantastic until yet. I think, the map will be finished and ready for download at midnight (E-time) :) I have to place about 6000!!! tiles manually :augh:
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by stiv » 23 Jan 2015, 21:45

I have to place about 6000!!! tiles manually
That sounds like a job for a computer.

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by Berg » 24 Jan 2015, 04:15

I see your tiles and i have to say they look terrible ...

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 24 Jan 2015, 10:11

Berg wrote:I see your tiles and i have to say they look terrible ...

Why? I need more informations. I like the water.
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by Berg » 24 Jan 2015, 22:42

Basically they are tiles they do not look like a cliff the terrain engine allows you to use a texture over many squares why are you going backward in time to original warzone style. Warzone has a fantastic terrain render system that's being ignored.
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=2383&hilit=terrain#p23123

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 25 Jan 2015, 00:36

Berg wrote:Basically they are tiles they do not look like a cliff the terrain engine allows you to use a texture over many squares why are you going backward in time to original warzone style. Warzone has a fantastic terrain render system that's being ignored.
viewtopic.php?f=33&t=2383&hilit=terrain#p23123
Hello Berg, now i see, what you want to say. I wrote, that i don`t like the cliffs in Arizona My subjective feeling). FlaME don`t use both cliff triangels and the others wrong. I want to try something new. Ok- I am not so happy with the landslide. But the water is not so bad. I was to enthusiastic when i wrote, that they are fantastic.Far away. Give me time. I make maps for a half year, because i could not see the 40oil/base NTW maps anymore. But this is again my subjective opinion. And i noticed, that there is a lack of maps in the addons section in the last time, because the other map makers have a real life with jobs, family...or they are working in the development for the campaign.

For this map i could not use the texture over many squares, because i have changed many tiles from water to cliffs, cliffs to water etc. I had to proof every tile, to be sure, that the map is playable. That the most important thing. So sorry, if i put to many maps into the addons section in last time (i read the rules now). But there is not so often a comment in the topics. And i did it for all the visitors. And they download my maps very often in a short time. I will now read the link.
Thanks for your answer. As usual i wish to say sorry for my bad english and
Regards
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by NoQ » 25 Jan 2015, 08:19

** insulting content deleted **

Let me answer. Cliff decals were added to improve playability of the old maps (otherwise the player had no idea if a certain passage is really unpassable or just too narrow, as it was much crisper on the old renderer; [1] is a really good example of an unplayable map). For any new maps, i'd also agree that it's better without cliff decals, or at least they need to be used very carefully. But unless we go for map-modding, we need a new map editor and a new map format for that.

** insulting content deleted **

All three is easy to do, as the engine trivially supports that and much more (such as double-resolution heightmaps [2]), just requires some time to implement.

Let me think. It shouldn't be hard to add just one extra tile into the tileset: A cliff-cliff-cliff-cliff tile without a cliff decal. This should be added on the game side (a commit with three lines of text; the change is so easy, we could probably even push it into some 3.1.3), and then FlaME dataset should be updated (which is even easier, you don't need to fix any distributable packages for that, and i can also use my 2.3-tileset generators to get a WYSIWYG feeling). And it would make it possible to make new maps without cliff decals. We can also add a water-water-water-water-tile without water, for easier mixing. The question is, would older maps still work if we modify the tileset?

Let me see. Should be no problem if we only extend it.

Please try to express your ideas without disparaging other members of the Warzone Community.
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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by NoQ » 25 Jan 2015, 11:24

Yeah, this actually works. I've managed to patch the game data (and the patch is really very lightweight) and produce a FlaME tileset archive necessary to make use of the new tiles (which is also based on hd tiles rather than the old FlaME tiles, because i don't care enough to draw an old-style tile for the new texture, and probably we already want to use these tiles anyway).

Old maps are loaded fluently; they don't even need to provide type information for the new tiles as long as they don't use them (and they don't, as long as they're old). New maps are loaded on the unpatched game without crashing, but the terrain color is incorrect (of course, how would it know).
Attachments
tilesets-hd.zip
Extended tilesets for FlaME.
(3.25 MiB) Downloaded 115 times
ExtraTiles-v1.patch
Necessary base game changes, as a patch.
(1.7 KiB) Downloaded 119 times
ExtraTiles-v1.wz
Necessary base game changes, as a mod.
(1.52 KiB) Downloaded 119 times

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by NoQ » 25 Jan 2015, 11:26

A few pictures and the proof-of-concept map.
Attachments
4c-test.wz
The proof-of-concept map.
(2.54 KiB) Downloaded 118 times
wz2100-20150125_120751-test-T1.jpg
Both cliffs with decals and cliffs without decals are now usable.
2015-01-25-115713_3200x1080_scrot.png
FlaME screenshot displaying the new tiles.

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Re: Some new cliff-ideas

Post by montetank » 25 Jan 2015, 14:41

NoQ wrote:Yeah
Yeah-thats the only i could say now. :lol2: It is fantastic. Can`t wait to make a map, but you should be the first. I am just testing the "new" campaign. Thanks a lot. Is this placed anywhere else in the forum? I don`t think, every map maker is reading this topic.
I am glad, that my topic has an excellent result :-)
Regards


PS: Tested ...it works fine :3
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