flaME -- The Warzone 2100 Map Editor [pre 1.10 thread]

[Flail13]

flaME maps can be put into a campaign. From what I remember, Editworld can't generate the scripts you need either.

Well, when I do that it takes much more time then making a selection, and there is 1 tile distance between the textures.
When I think about it more, a 'Lock Selection' option which would prvent any editing out of the selection would be better.
...
It is, and I would prefer a simple GUI for making and automatically including those INI files rather then writing them myself in Notepad and placing them into the map archive.

I'm not sure about those requests. "Lock Selection" seems like more work than it's worth. The challenge ini file is easy for you to make, but also easy for me to add in.

[Buginator]

Kuky, no there isn't. Do you need it? Is there a situation where you cant just paint another terrain around where you want to fill?

I have another question for the devs...

Someone has requested info from me on how to put an artifact onto a multiplayer map. Do you have any objections to maps with scripts in them? and will they function correctly in multiplayer? From what I've tried so far they work in skirmish, except when the speed in increased above 1.5. In that case enableResearch doesn't seem to work.

Just what kind of scripts we talking about here ?

I would have to see it first to tell you more. I can tell you that if you are replacing a current script, then no, don't do that, it will cause many problems.

Oh, also, I finished fixing it so people can now have X player maps, where X is from 2-8. This would need a new flaME version, however, this change will *not* be in 2.3.5.
Note to everyone else, this will also mean that you can't use EW32 to create maps that are NOT 2/4/8 player--unless you want to hand edit.
This also means that 3/5/6/7 player maps won't work on old versions of Warzone, so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

There's a WZ site Terminator showed me that contains a lot of WZ content. In that content is a functional campaign editor. Flail, you should update your map editor so it can support campaign missions.

Yeah, as Flail13 said... nothing new there, and it is NOT functional for making real campaigns, unless someone fixed it, which I doubt.

[Flail13]

Buginator, the skirmish/multiplayer map test I made is attached. It doesn't change any existing scripts. It has an extra wrf listed in the .addon.lev, which links to new scripts that place an artifact in the middle of the map. When the artifact is picked up, it enables the nexus link turret research for that player.
I've also been trying to make a challenge that behaves as a mission and has its own stats files and scripts, but it isn't listed in skirmish or multiplayer. Would that interfere with something?

Does the 3,5,6,7 player option need to be added in soon so that people can make maps for it, or is this just advance warning?

edit: I've answered my own question about the challenge - it crashes warzone when playing any normal map.

[lav_coyote25]

Note to everyone else, this will also mean that you can't use EW32 to create maps that are NOT 2/4/8 player--unless you want to hand edit.
This also means that 3/5/6/7 player maps won't work on old versions of Warzone, so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

then dont do it.

[KukY]

then dont do it.

So, 3,5,6 and 7 player maps shouldn't be possible becuase you wouldn't be able to make them in tool you usually work in, but in a diffrent tool? Don't think so.

[Rman Virgil]

Note to everyone else, this will also mean that you can't use EW32 to create maps that are NOT 2/4/8 player--unless you want to hand edit.

This also means that 3/5/6/7 player maps won't work on old versions of Warzone, so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

These are trade-offs and, IMHO, the whole new world of creative map designs now made possible far outweighs a perhaps less than elegant break from the past. But as the great Pablo Picasso put it:

Every act of creation begins with an act of destruction.

One other thing Pablo "destroyed", of passing interest, was the need for money when he went shopping or dinning. After a fabulous feast worth thousands, for example, he'd grab a napkin, do a quick little doodle and the establishment would gladly accept it as payment in full.

Still, I don't understand what you are getting at when you say:

......so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

There's a WZ site Terminator showed me that contains a lot of WZ content. In that content is a functional campaign editor. Flail, you should update your map editor so it can support campaign missions.

Yeah, as Flail13 said... nothing new there, and it is NOT functional for making real campaigns, unless someone fixed it, which I doubt.

That is World Edit, what Pumpkin used to make the original campaign maps. They disabled parts of it, renamed it Edit World and released it reluctantly in June '99.

World Edit NEVER had CAM Scripting functionality like say the original "Star Craft" Map Editor.... Pumpkin still had to write scripts by hand in NotePad.

Peeps are always searching for an EASY way to script new campaign missions. In fact there was created a WZ Campaign Mission Editor that made it considerably easier to script new missions and you would have thought the floodgates of creativity would have opened up and all sorts of new campaign missions created and released. Nothing of the sort happened. Not a single one was created. Still not easy enough, I guess, like say an OOP UI A.I. Script Editor - which will never be created for WZ so it's gonna be NotePad++, dedicated learning & sustained hard work that will yield new campaign missions and that is simply the antithesis of what is meant by the phrase immediate gratification.

- RV
.

[Buginator]

Buginator, the skirmish/multiplayer map test I made is attached. It doesn't change any existing scripts. It has an extra wrf listed in the .addon.lev, which links to new scripts that place an artifact in the middle of the map. When the artifact is picked up, it enables the nexus link turret research for that player.
I've also been trying to make a challenge that behaves as a mission and has its own stats files and scripts, but it isn't listed in skirmish or multiplayer. Would that interfere with something?

If you would prefix all directories and file names for the scripts with the same unique name, then one issue will be avoided, however, doing scripts in maps isn't a very good idea, since the scripts can conflict in a number of ways, and it will make it that much more difficult to debug things when things go wrong.

I rather see "pure" maps, and not hybrid map/mods -- we already had a case of the hybrid map/mod, and it messed up lots of things.

[Buginator]

Still, I don't understand what you are getting at when you say:

......so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

There's a WZ site Terminator showed me that contains a lot of WZ content. In that content is a functional campaign editor. Flail, you should update your map editor so it can support campaign missions.

Yeah, as Flail13 said... nothing new there, and it is NOT functional for making real campaigns, unless someone fixed it, which I doubt.

That is World Edit, what Pumpkin used to make the original campaign maps. They disabled parts of it, renamed it Edit World and released it reluctantly in June '99.

World Edit NEVER had CAM Scripting functionality like say the original "Star Craft" Map Editor.... Pumpkin still had to write scripts by hand in NotePad.

Peeps are always searching for an EASY way to script new campaign missions. In fact there was created a WZ Campaign Mission Editor that made it considerably easier to script new missions and you would have thought the floodgates of creativity would have opened up and all sorts of new campaign missions created and released. Nothing of the sort happened. Not a single one was created. Still not easy enough, I guess, like say an OOP UI A.I. Script Editor - which will never be created for WZ so it's gonna be NotePad++, dedicated learning & sustained hard work that will yield new campaign missions and that is simply the antithesis of what is meant by the phrase immediate gratification.

- RV
.

That is basically what I meant, in that, there is no all-in-one solution to making campaign missions as some people think there is.

[Buginator]

Does the 3,5,6,7 player option need to be added in soon so that people can make maps for it, or is this just advance warning?

Ok, here is the deal, I need a new option in flaME, a checkbox to enable support for X player maps (I am thinking this would be 2.4 or higher versions of warzone, but am not 100% sure for right now, so perhaps just "beta: X player support" for right now ?) , and what that will do is, NOT produce a *mapname.addon.lev file, but instead, produce a *mapname.xplayers.lev file.

This is so that these new maps can't be used on old game versions, and break...

The format is exactly the same as the old file, except, you do:

level testmap-T1
players 2
type 14
dataset MULTI_CAM_1
game "multiplay/maps/2c-testmap.gam"
data "wrf/multi/skirmish2.wrf"
data "wrf/multi/fog1.wrf"

Where the red number indicates the number of players.

Make sense ?

For the lobby screen, so far, it looks like :

One other thing, if possible, can you add a pull down menu under the Author edit box, that includes what license the user picks for the map, then stick that in the header as

// Made with flaME v1.09
// Date: 2010/09/12 23:32:17
// Author: Flail13
// License: see below

For the license:
If you want inclusion with Warzone 2100, you have several options:

• GPL 2+
• CC BY 3.0 + GPL v2+
• CC BY-SA 3.0 + GPL v2+
• CC0

TIA!

BTW lav_Coyote, I don't know why you wouldn't want this, it isn't my fault that EW32 can't support this stuff without hand editing everything... EW32 maps will still load OK, but you just can't use that version to make 3/5/6/7 player maps.

[Zarel]

I have an idea for backwards compatibility:

Make them 8-player maps, but add special files for 6-player maps that new versions can recognize.

[Rman Virgil]

Comments on World Edit & CAM scripting........................

That is basically what I meant, in that, there is no all-in-one solution to making campaign missions as some people think there is.

Oh.. sorry, I thought when you said:

......so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

You were referring to this:

Note to everyone else, this will also mean that you can't use EW32 to create maps that are NOT 2/4/8 player--unless you want to hand edit.

This also means that 3/5/6/7 player maps won't work on old versions of Warzone, so trying to think of a good way to handle this.

- RV
.

[Flail13]

A few things to clarify:

Is Zarel's idea plausable? Some problems I can think of:
- Map makers would probably need to place units for the excess teams in the old version.
- If scavengers are placed on a 5-7 player map, they might be interpreted as a player's units in old warzones.

Can a 3,5-7 player map have scavengers?

For the name of the .lev, should there be "xc-" infront of the map name still?

"Make sense?" -- Basically you're saying the format will be exactly the same?

Should the license be able to be left blank or have an "other" option?

[Buginator]

A few things to clarify:

Is Zarel's idea plausable? Some problems I can think of:
- Map makers would probably need to place units for the excess teams in the old version.
- If scavengers are placed on a 5-7 player map, they might be interpreted as a player's units in old warzones.

No, his idea would require more hacks. I don't like messing with what the game does now.

Can a 3,5-7 player map have scavengers?

I believe it would have the same limitations as before, but, I am not sure about 7p maps--I haven't tested anything scav related yet... Throw me a link to a beta version so I can do some test.

For the name of the .lev, should there be "xc-" infront of the map name still?

Yes, that is required and needed.

"Make sense?" -- Basically you're saying the format will be exactly the same?

Right, the red numbers would be in the range of 2-8 now.

Should the license be able to be left blank or have an "other" option?

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that, I guess you can add "other", the ones I listed are known to work for all distros, so that is why I listed them.
If it is blank, then that means we have to run and find the person to get their permission, which is what I am trying to avoid by making them pick something, then editing the file with the license they want. I rather not do that, and I am thinking we should just not accept any maps that don't have a proper license.

Unsure if you want to do this, but you could also have a description box, and people type in whatever there, and then, include a mapinfo.readme file in the .wz ?

[Flail13]

Buginator, here is a test map with 7 players and scavengers.

Kuky, is that image anything like what you wanted when you asked to show the tile rotations? When the tile is at its normal orientation, the indicator is in the top-left corner of the tile and pointing clockwise.

[KukY]

Kuky, is that image anything like what you wanted when you asked to show the tile rotations? When the tile is at its normal orientation, the indicator is in the top-left corner of the tile and pointing clockwise.

Yeah, something like that. But it was more about mass changing the rotations.