Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Discussions about AI types, units, tactics & strategy.
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Merowingg
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Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Merowingg » 07 Jul 2012, 07:25

Over some time I have spent here, I have noticed majority of the players are lazy.

What I mean is that they use basic things to win the game. I assume it is connected with this having many perfect ranks thing.

I have to admit I was very happy few times to take part in games, where I won, or lost in let me call it epic games, where really nice strategic terms were involved.

I dont even try to explain, or to discuss what is more strategic, or less, or what is strategy, or not. What I mean here is that all players simply somehow play the easiest way to win.

Maybe some advices, or manual of some sorts of strategic playing would be good? for more advanced players, or for those who want to be really strategic players? I do know there are nice manuals, even very nice about basic handling of the game, but maybe some old wolves from here would share some tips with those who can put it into site nicely, and share with others?

I somehow call for something more than MG and to the enemy thing.

Do not play easy, use your brains! have fun!
“Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, and ideas are bulletproof.” - V

"Mark my words boy, Mark them well, I have survived your predecessors and I will survive you." - Merovingian

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Iluvalar
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Iluvalar » 07 Jul 2012, 19:49

You really can't ask the players to reduce their chance to win in a competitive game. In a creative game like minecraft, you can give them fences, glass and different wood color, and they will do a lovely sheep farm even if they don't really need wool.

But warzone2100 was not that kind of game. You can't ask people to "not play easy". They will push the strongest strategies they can. What makes good players play more complex strategies was a very fragile equilibrium in the stats file that make more complex strategies more efficient at the end than simpler one.

Saddly, there is no more game designer in the main dev team that appear to be simply aware of what that equilibrium is made of. And there been a lot of changes in the game mechanic since then. There is apparently a strong belief in our community that a magic "balance" fairy will soon come around here and fix everything that is tagged as "easy to fix" while, in reality, nobody even know what it require to "fix" it at all...

Be ready when you play 3.1 to see more and more dumb strategies "mass produce and throw units" that will lead to a legitimate victory. There was a scary amount of control mechanics in the game that was slowly leading the players up to T3 that are now just erased or changed beyond recognition. When he forget why there is a constraint, the human tend naturally to remove it. That's what we see just now, with a mass of people praising the destruction of control points in your game. This game is morphing, soon it gonna be a creative game for people that like to play with tanks and you will be kicked if you don't role play and try to win for real in a game.
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Merowingg
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Merowingg » 08 Jul 2012, 08:04

Thank you Iluvalar for your post.

You have also given me the general idea of the situation I was already partly aware of.
“Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, and ideas are bulletproof.” - V

"Mark my words boy, Mark them well, I have survived your predecessors and I will survive you." - Merovingian

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Giani
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Giani » 08 Jul 2012, 16:44

Iluvalar wrote:...
Be ready when you play 3.1 to see more and more dumb strategies "mass produce and throw units" that will lead to a legitimate victory. There was a scary amount of control mechanics in the game that was slowly leading the players up to T3 that are now just erased or changed beyond recognition...
Dumb strategies? In 3.1? When 2.3.9 is just about making the enemy's units get random explosions and teleporting your tanks?
And the "mass produce and throw units" only exists in 2.3.9, because micromanage has no-sense because of the desynchs. In 3.1 if you move your tanks back, they really move.
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Iluvalar
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Iluvalar » 08 Jul 2012, 18:18

Giani wrote: Dumb strategies? In 3.1? When 2.3.9 is just about making the enemy's units get random explosions and teleporting your tanks?
Yeah, except "random" explosions only occur when someone kill the tank and you can only "teleport" to where you drived your tank to.

You are so much amplifying those desynchs and disregarding stuffs that were changed in 3.1.

I know some games in 2.3 are completly out of synch, but it's the same games that are now in permanent "zzz" or suffer from random quit.
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Giani
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Giani » 09 Jul 2012, 16:44

Yes, but it is better a "zzz" than random explosions.
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Iluvalar
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Iluvalar » 09 Jul 2012, 18:38

fine, but i'm not just talking about Zzzes
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Merowingg
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Re: Why so Lazy Player? Why so Lazy?

Post by Merowingg » 04 Aug 2012, 11:09

Giani you are relatively young in time being here, so 2.3.9, is like a thing for you. While many of us, were, let me say, rised on 2.3.9 You arso may be the new generation, which willingly or not follow the graphic and anything new path.

I also do not understand this IRC voting, and "reducing" 2.3.9 in many forms. Why it cannot be simly let be? Can anyone explain to me why it is that way?

I know the obvious reason someone has update it, ok. So if no one will do, it will fail. Now, if a people decide to update it? what then? Why so much ado about it? Seriously I would like to know. I am very often quite blind about things here.

For me it is simple, no one suports 2.3.9, it dies, maybe reactivated in some time, and that is all. This strange voting, is it something like what is better PC or console? black or white?
“Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, and ideas are bulletproof.” - V

"Mark my words boy, Mark them well, I have survived your predecessors and I will survive you." - Merovingian

Regards - Mero

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