v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

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Mr T
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v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Mr T » 11 Dec 2012, 22:03

Me and my friends use WZ2100 to play the game together on a server. So when we now installed the new version 3.1 we become wonderingly about "Nexus", "Null bot" and "Semperfi".
What dose this name means ? Why no info ? Why do I have to play the game to understand the game ?

I have earlier asked to get info in the game about the different guns (power, rate, distens and so on).

It's a great game, but if the game may work for all, not only the ppl that lived with it, slept with it, make loved ... no that mabe to much ... A game need to be easy to get a grip on, even for a NOOB. Just a small info text next to the name "Nexus", "Null bot", "VTOL", "Inferno", "EMP Cannon".... and so on. A "i" that open a info window or something.



Great graphic on the maps ! LOVE IT ! Great work there. Also love the funktion that u can klick non built buildings with other trucks to help out (maby an old funktion, but I seen it in this version)
I felt that the cars become more stupid. More often they "crashed" into each other and stand "nose" to "nose" and didn't get any where. The "circling" was cool, but not always good. One time the enemy had like 30 VOLT circling round and round and didn't get anywhere. Easy target but...

U guys doing a GREAT GAME, but remember that a great game is not just nice graphic and cool function, it is mostly how easy it it to control for the ppl.

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Jorzi » 11 Dec 2012, 22:23

Unfortunately the pathfinding was affected by other changes and still has unresolved bugs.
Yeah, it can be a hard game to get into, especially the tech tree etc.. There are some resources to be found on the subject, like http://guide.wz2100.net/r/tech-tree, but unfortunately no one has gotten to writing/implementing tooltips...
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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by aubergine » 11 Dec 2012, 23:03

Version 3.1.0 puts in a temporary fix for the "log jamming" issue (where cars bump in to each other and get stuck), it should be out in a few days hopefully so download it when it gets released.

As for the AIs:

* Nexus is the original AI that's been around since 2.x versions, unfortunately there isn't much (if any) documentation about it. Be aware that it cheats a little and gives itself free power or sudden advances in technology.
* Semperfi is a basic AI used for testing the new scripting environment, you can find some info in the wiki
* NullBot is a relatively new AI, which has lots of documentation both in the forums and it has it's own wiki

There are a number of other wikis that provide information on the game, scripting, and other stuff, listed here: https://warzone.atlassian.net/wiki/disp ... Z+websites (it takes a few moments to load for some reason, it's much faster when logged in on that wiki, I have no idea why).

You can find a lot of info about weapons, etc., both in the tech tree (see link that Jorzi posted) and the rest of the guide: http://guide.wz2100.net/

For circling VTOLs, make sure that there are re-arming pads. Circling VTOLs can be very effective at defending an area of the map, and even when attacking enemy bases you can tell them to circle at the enemy base and they will attack everything in range of the circle, rearm themselves and then continue circling.
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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by aubergine » 11 Dec 2012, 23:10

Oh, and here are some PDFs that explain certain parts of the tech tree a bit more: viewtopic.php?f=49&t=9026
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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Per » 11 Dec 2012, 23:22

The Semperfi AI in 3.1 actually has nothing to do with the new scripting system. It uses the old wzscript. It was a testing grounds for me to try new things for the AI using wzscript, and is quite a bit better than Nexus on some maps, but falls short on others, doing stupid things that messes it up (because it tries to be too smart and fails).

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by NoQ » 12 Dec 2012, 08:08

Why do I have to play the game to understand the game ?
Question of the month! :D

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Mr T » 12 Dec 2012, 10:40

NoQ wrote:
Why do I have to play the game to understand the game ?
Question of the month! :D
LOL - that did not come out right. The correct question is "Why do I have to play the campaign to understand the game" :-)


I dont think that any of my "why" about the game hasn't an answer. Every thing is ther for a reason, even different version of the AI. All the answer about different AI, where I can get info about the guns and so on seems to be on the web site, but how can I have time to go out from the server in the middle of the game to check what gun is the better one to develop in the heat of the war ? (Just as an example)

Thx for all the answer, but I think the next version would be focus on "easy to use". Not saying that all the different AI types and other cool extra function shouldn't be there, just be hidden behind a button or in advanced feature or something. Like the "Set Structure Limits" is behind a button, a button not for NOOBs, but probably very good for more advanced players. (Just a button like that I like to have for development, so me and my friends can play a longer game with smaler guns, or without VTOL or Laser Satellite Command Post)

Once again, thx u ALL for a great game !

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by zydonk » 12 Dec 2012, 14:20

The early missions of the campaign function as tutorials. That's not uncommon. WZ was never meant to be an easy game, though - believe it or not - it's a lot easier now than it used to be.

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Mr T » 12 Dec 2012, 14:58

zydonk wrote:The early missions of the campaign function as tutorials. That's not uncommon.
True! But why be as all the other, why not try to become unique and better ?
Some tutorial campaign is always good, but if it is possible to not have to choose "type of AI", just be able to choose level of difficulty, and so on, the game will probably gain a bigger audience. Dont u think ?
zydonk wrote: WZ was never meant to be an easy game, though - believe it or not - it's a lot easier now than it used to be.
I belive u, and an easy game without any depth will lose its audience pretty fast. Keep on digging, make it more advanced, more cool stuff, but dont show all the extra function right away. Hide them behind "extra feature" buttons and so on.
In the AI/level choice, switch it. Level (Easy, normal...) on the first screen, and type of AI code next. Thats how u make that choice easier.
Exempel, all the extra feature that's been talking about that can be downloded and installed, why not an extra page and a HMI for that. Easier to use, more ppl that use them and can comment on them.

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by aubergine » 12 Dec 2012, 16:50

We'd love a better interface in the game, but the UI code is quite difficult to work with currently. It will get improved at some point, but if anyone would like to help with coding the source is available at: https://github.com/Warzone2100
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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by NoQ » 12 Dec 2012, 18:44

Mr T wrote:I dont think that any of my "why" about the game hasn't an answer. Every thing is ther for a reason, even different version of the AI. All the answer about different AI, where I can get info about the guns and so on seems to be on the web site, but how can I have time to go out from the server in the middle of the game to check what gun is the better one to develop in the heat of the war ? (Just as an example)
Did this quite a few times, including some very hot matches; mostly looking up the tech tree. Should be quick enough when you know where to look. It's a popular suggestion to allow a tech tree lookup inside the game, and also hard to implement.

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Mr T » 12 Dec 2012, 19:55

Tried to switch between Wz2100 and the browser, nut on mac it dont seams to work. In other program it work fine. So even if that is an okey solution, I dont seam to use it (and on the PC, the new version dont wont to work, or rather work soooooo slooooow so I havent been abel to start the game sins the menus LAGing)

But if I do a blue print, then I can see the guns different values, why cant I see that when I about to develop it ?

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by NoQ » 12 Dec 2012, 22:19

First of all, nobody plays fullscreen once they find out that Alt+T (or wherever you reassign it) does trap cursor for you. This takes care of all related video driver issues. All unrelated video driver issues you seem to encounter on your pc (since most people play 3.1 normally on pc) can usually be fixed on your side.
But if I do a blue print, then I can see the guns different values,
There are quite a lot of things that you can't see there anyway.

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by Mr T » 15 Dec 2012, 01:15

Over to something completely different... but still in the HMI area.

Why is the 3 tech level buttons ("T1","T2" and "T3") in the "map" window. Why isn't that chose with the other chooses ? HMI !!!

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Re: v 3.1 - Easy game ...NOT

Post by aubergine » 15 Dec 2012, 01:56

T1/2/3 = tech levels. I'm permanently confused by them, does anyone actually use them?
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