Two questions about 8-player skirmish

[leo_virgo]

I have troubles playing 8-player skirmish game. Here are my two questions:

1. Is there any general guide on this mode of game? "Early-game strategy" in the guide page is not enough for me.
2. When the game starts, do you slow down the game or not? E.g. slow the game speed down to 0.3?

Thanks in advance.

[NoQ]

I didn't really understand the troubles you have. You want to beat AI bots 1vs7? All right, one little hint here: the easiest way to kill an AI is to use cyborgs. Cannon cyborgs, then lancer cyborgs as AA and, as a bonus, AT. Bots tend to emphasize on AT weapons too much, and can't protect themselves well against borgs.

No, slowing down the game doesn't seem to be necessary, because there are only very things you can do at early stage, and queueing orders leaves you a lot of free time in fact.

Anyway, beating AIs is a strange thing to practice. Most people who are at least somehow capable of this are already playing online instead, not considering playing with bots to be of any interest.

[leo_virgo]

Thank you NoQ! The FRCFF strategy you introduced to me highly affects how I start a game now. I want to win a Hide Behind Me challenge once. I don't think I'm good enough to play against human players, as WZ2100 is the only RTS game I've ever played, and I'm not very good at playing RTS games yet. I want to play skirmish for a longer time then play with human players.

[NoQ]

I want to play skirmish for a longer time then play with human players.

Hmm, i feel some dualism inside my brain when i read this. On one hand, i strongly discourage anybody joining online games before actually learning the game rules, for it's a waste of time for stronger players to play with this kind of noob. On the other hand, i strongly encourage not to sit on skirmish for too long, because by playing with AI bots you learn too many wrong things; that's something like learning to play a guitar without knowing how to place fingers on it. So we seem to be running into some eternal question again. Ouch.

[leo_virgo]

I want to play skirmish for a longer time then play with human players.

Hmm, i feel some dualism inside my brain when i read this. On one hand, i strongly discourage anybody joining online games before actually learning the game rules, for it's a waste of time for stronger players to play with this kind of noob. On the other hand, i strongly encourage not to sit on skirmish for too long, because by playing with AI bots you learn too many wrong things; that's something like learning to play a guitar without knowing how to place fingers on it. So we seem to be running into some eternal question again. Ouch.

I tried the Cyborg strategy, it worked perfectly for 8-player skirmish but did not work for challenge Hide Behind Me, mostly because when I was rushing one of the opponents' base the other opponents helped defending it. But it did give me a hint and I will improve my strategy to win that challenge. Thanks.

What are the "wrong things" you referred? Could you please elaborate on that?

[NoQ]

What are the "wrong things" you referred? Could you please elaborate on that?

This cyborg strategy is one of them. The unusual efficiency of turtling (especially bunkers and lancers) against bots is another. Anyway, bots have obvious flaws, and playing against them is learning to exploit these flaws rather than actually playing well.

P.S. Worked well for me on "Hide behind me" (:

[leo_virgo]

This cyborg strategy is one of them. The unusual efficiency of turtling (especially bunkers and lancers) against bots is another. Anyway, bots have obvious flaws, and playing against them is learning to exploit these flaws rather than actually playing well.

Is there some easy game online? I'm not sure what level I'm currently at, a n00b or a normal player. I'm kind of afraid of joining online games, due to this uncertainty (I don't want to be blamed).

P.S. Worked well for me on "Hide behind me" (:

Ah that's why I don't want to play online for now -- I need my skills improved.

[NoQ]

I'm kind of afraid of joining online games, due to this uncertainty (I don't want to be blamed).

The easiest and most friendly way is to come to IRC and ask for a game, underlining that you want training or something like that. Joining games randomly will always lead to one or another psychological issue ... (:

Ah that's why I don't want to play online for now -- I need my skills improved.

I'm not sure i could have beaten it unless i started playing online. This challenge is pretty hard already.

P.S. If you want to see how stupid AIs really are, try to beat this one (:

[Iluvalar]

Anyway, bots have obvious flaws, and playing against them is learning to exploit these flaws rather than actually playing well.

Hmm, that's not what you said the last time my borgs scouted into your side and just happened to "walk" into your base. lol.

I don't agree with you about playing skirmish. It's true that the AI as some obvious flaws when you know then and would be stupid as hell if it was not cheating that much. But if you don't abuse of those flaws, the AI at hard is quite a challenge and a worthy opponent.

Come... Take the team of players of your choice, i'll be the leader of an AI faction. We'll see what happen.

[NoQ]

Hmm, that's not what you said the last time my borgs scouted into your side and just happened to "walk" into your base. lol.

(: lol (: yeah (: i had a few epic fails against borgs too (: but at least i learn something from this

Come... Take the team of players of your choice, i'll be the leader of an AI faction. We'll see what happen.

sure, any time we meet on irc, just remind me (:
Anyway, i believe you will fail against a stupid machine gun rush in this layout; each one of "us" rushes exactly one enemy as soon as possible, and even if you survive this, your AI friends won't.

[Germanium]

@leo_virgo: i never played you, but i can tell from your posts you are not a noob anymore already. It seems you already know some kind of build order (FRCFF) from NoQ (build order differs for low/high power maps) and that is already more than most players know. If you even research and build upgrades you are almost a good player already. Just join some random games... teamgames are best to learn (spend every free time you find in that game to look at the other players in your team and compare their moves/stuffs with yours).

Good luck!

[leo_virgo]

After many attempts, I finally won the challenge Hide Behind Me yesterday.

I sent the initial two trucks to the pink and black base and built many machinegun towers there, this strategy successfully destroyed these two bases. Orange and White helped to defend the center area meanwhile. Finally I destroyed the other opponents' bases with a lot of Groundshaker emplacements. I didn't produce any attack units during the game, only built defending structures. The only units I produced were trucks and cyborg mechanics. AI's helped greatly in defending the center area but not destroying the bases.

How do you think about this strategy, NoQ? I tried those strategies written by Mats and erthad in the challenge forum, but didn't succeed.

[leo_virgo]

@leo_virgo: i never played you, but i can tell from your posts you are not a noob anymore already. It seems you already know some kind of build order (FRCFF) from NoQ (build order differs for low/high power maps) and that is already more than most players know. If you even research and build upgrades you are almost a good player already. Just join some random games... teamgames are best to learn (spend every free time you find in that game to look at the other players in your team and compare their moves/stuffs with yours).

Good luck!

Thanks for the encouragement. By winning the challenge Hide Behind Me, I'm more confident now I can get trained by somebody online and join online games. Maybe see you there

[NoQ]

How do you think about this strategy, NoQ?

Truck rush?
That's another thing bots are very weak against, but humans usually aren't (even though it can sometimes work well when implemented properly and the map is suitable; usually mixed with half-builds).

Anyway, how much time did it take? My cyborg spam took around 40 minutes, as far as i remember, but i might be wrong, and i'm not sure about the game version (which might have had some critical bugs).

[leo_virgo]

Anyway, how much time did it take?

The reported time is about 1:30 (I don't remember the exact time), but since I slowed down the game to 0.3 at the beginning, I spent more time than this.

Btw, this is the first time I understand what "truck rush" means, thanks