Cheaters IPs.

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Wisler
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Cheaters IPs.

Post by Wisler » 26 Sep 2010, 19:09

My last topic was locked, lay coyote i know you dont play the game much (that i know off) but cheaters are a very annoying thing to us honest players, no matter what your opinion maybe.

Bendibs IP 68.2.83.143 (newly discovered cheater) uses multiple names in cluding NgMaRe.

Flexs IP 190.161.52.123 (well know cheater) also know as backer, andreas and gauus.

I think the honest players deserve to know who plays by the rules and who will ruin there warzone expereince.

If you delete this i will post it till you ban me even though it is not breaking the forum rules, if you ban i will ask anothe rhonest player to post it as i know they gladly will.

I know of many others who are probably using hacks/cheats but i will not post their information here as i am not 100% certain only 99%.

Right now this is only thing being done to stop them.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.

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lav_coyote25
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by lav_coyote25 » 26 Sep 2010, 19:27

posting their ip's on the forums isnt going to stop anyone. i wont delete nor lock this. just so your aware - posting the ips means nothing. posting the names, means nothing both can be spoofed or changed. whatever. thing is if your bringing irc arguments here - that will cease as of 10 years ago. you understand??? if not , well, we wont go there for now. :lol2:

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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Wisler » 26 Sep 2010, 19:38

lav_coyote25 wrote:posting their ip's on the forums isnt going to stop anyone. i wont delete nor lock this. just so your aware - posting the ips means nothing. posting the names, means nothing both can be spoofed or changed. whatever. thing is if your bringing irc arguments here - that will cease as of 10 years ago. you understand??? if not , well, we wont go there for now. :lol2:
Mabye it wont stop them but its best thing being done to stop them.
Failure is not falling down but refusing to get up.

Pm me to try out for RBL.

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lav_coyote25
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by lav_coyote25 » 26 Sep 2010, 19:43

and it stops them how??? outline the points how it makes people stop cheating.... seriously... think about it. O_o

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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by cumandgetit » 26 Sep 2010, 19:45

lav_coyote25 wrote:posting their ip's on the forums isnt going to stop anyone. i wont delete nor lock this. just so your aware - posting the ips means nothing. posting the names, means nothing both can be spoofed or changed. whatever.
true. even closed source, proprietary, games cannot eliminate cheaters. and they get off on this type attention. getting peeps goat is very satisfying to them. as much as the act of cheating. open-source game - hell will freeze-over before you stop em. still, you can deny them the satisfaction of getting to you because that is what they thrive on. it sounds counter-intuitive but it is all about a certain type attention. basically, not so much winning a game as taking over your mind like a puppeteer pulling your strings.

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Black Project
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Black Project » 26 Sep 2010, 19:48

There's a option to kick cheaters even in-game, hold Right Mouse Button over the channel icon of the player you want to kick, then press Left Mouse Button to kick the unwanted player.

Don't know if it helps, since it's not everybody that knows this feature (if i'm wrong correct me), but, anyway, as you said before, cheaters tend to spoil most of great games of good players.

BP :ninja:

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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Germanium » 26 Sep 2010, 19:57

lav_coyote25 wrote:and it stops them how??? outline the points how it makes people stop cheating.... seriously... think about it. O_o
Interestingly enough for _some_ of the cheaters it seems more complicated to change a nick/ip than abusing loopholes in the code. Thats why keeping a "cheating" and "suspected cheating" list is a good idea until that matter is solved server side finally.

Is this a matter of the forums? Probably not if it werent a problem. Give it a new section? Maybe. I think posting names/ips of cheaters can help up to a point. Of course it does not prevent cheating in any way but at least the will have to disconnect and get a new ip or leave, start skirimish, change name, come back. Will that be fun for them? I dont know but i do know cheaters like their names as much as we do.

The kicking option is gladly not exploited by cheaters yet (although they have the ability to do so) and unfortunately it does not help much unless it was an unfair game before... having a 3v4 while it is supposed to be a 4v4 or even worse 1v2 instead of 2v2 is not resolveing the issue.

It would help at least me to understand you, coyote, if you could give me/us a reason for not posting ips/names? Does it hurt anyone? Are you afraid of false accusations/ flame war on the forums? Or of the fact that it is possible to cheat in wz? I really would like to know what is so bad about a post that person X is a cheater.... he could even defend himself.
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Buginator
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Buginator » 26 Sep 2010, 20:20

Germanium wrote: The kicking option is gladly not exploited by cheaters yet (although they have the ability to do so) ...
Eh ? Only the host can kick, that has been the case for all 2.3.5 releases.


p.s I am the one that moved all these posts to this forum section.
I am also not sure IP posting is allowed, since some German law kicks in about privacy, and the server is in Germany. :hmm:
and it ends here.

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bendib
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by bendib » 26 Sep 2010, 20:25

His posting of the IP is futile. I can change it whenever I feel like it. It's done by changing the router's MAC address. Takes less than five minutes. I have decided not to just quit. Wislers accusations of me hosing games under other names is not true. I also do not remember flex to be a cheater, but who knows.

Wisler: Your attempts at barring me have failed. I have admitted to what I did do, the rest is your imagination/paranoia.

I will use another user name. I will become a user you all trust, and then I will reveal my identity.
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JDW
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by JDW » 26 Sep 2010, 20:51

bendib wrote:I will use another user name. I will become a user you all trust, and then I will reveal my identity.
Me thinks that that's going to make you appear even more untrustworthy than how the guys in the IRC look at you now. Bad call again kiddo. :)
"Speak when you are angry and you will make the best speech you will ever regret."
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Zarel » 26 Sep 2010, 21:22

This, by the way, is why I rarely lock topics in the heat of argument - people will just get even more pissed off, and/or open another topic. :| I'd rather confine discussion to a single topic.

I reiterate what I said before: It appears to be the situation that bendib and a few other players got in a misunderstanding about whether or not cheating is allowed (and the ensuing flamewar didn't help, either). I told him not to cheat unless he gets everyone's permission at the beginning of a game, and if he stops cheating, we have no problem, and if he doesn't, we ban him then, and we still have no problem.
3drts wrote:In my mind, any amount of cheating hoses a game.
3drts wrote:IMO, this form is acceptable, where it is out in the open for everyone, and does not affect the outcome. Cheating after you've been defeated just to watch, I would consider acceptable.
See, this is the problem - you say that all cheating is bad, but then you say that form of cheating is okay.

Me, I can see several forms of cheating as being okay. I've cheated to fix bugs before - last bug I fixed that way was a template bug. But cheating, to bendib, seems to be like a mod to enable features the core game otherwise doesn't support, which seems fine to me as long as it's made explicit what people can do.

Under this viewpoint, the main thing bendib did wrong was to ask about using cheats, and then use them before getting an explicit "yes". As long as we can teach him to wait for an explicit "yes" from every player in the future, I think letting him off with a warning is good enough.

As for him changing IPs to get into games he shouldn't be getting into: On one hand, a lot of players made him sound much worse than he is. On another, lying to get into games with people who don't want you in them is pretty bad. I'll let someone else make the judgment on how exactly we should handle the IP change situation.

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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by bendib » 26 Sep 2010, 21:29

j0shdrunk0nwar wrote:
bendib wrote:I will use another user name. I will become a user you all trust, and then I will reveal my identity.
Me thinks that that's going to make you appear even more untrustworthy than how the guys in the IRC look at you now. Bad call again kiddo. :)
Well you would boot me if you knew it was me. How else? If it makes you think I'm sneaky, oh well. At least you would then know I intended on fair games. And one thing you may want to know that bugs me quite a bit:
I have the social skills of an enraged gorilla. I'm not dumb, but I'm not too bright in that area.
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by bendib » 26 Sep 2010, 21:32

Zarel wrote: As for him changing IPs to get into games he shouldn't be getting into: On one hand, a lot of players made him sound much worse than he is. On another, lying to get into games with people who don't want you in them is pretty bad. I'll let someone else make the judgment on how exactly we should handle the IP change situation.
I do not plan on joining games that my most hated enemies are in, just people who judged me by what others told them. Tell me, if you enjoyed a game, and some wanker came along and made you look like genghis khan, what would you be doing? IF someone doesn't want me for a reason other than figuring out my old username, I will leave on my own. Actually, if they figure it out, I'll just flat out leave.
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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Germanium » 26 Sep 2010, 22:00

Buginator wrote:
Germanium wrote: The kicking option is gladly not exploited by cheaters yet (although they have the ability to do so) ...
Eh ? Only the host can kick, that has been the case for all 2.3.5 releases.
correct, but as some cheaters are able to kick people in the lobby (while not being the host themselves) - at least this was the case for 2.3.4 (dont know if that changed) - why should they not being able to kick people during the game? I agree - i have not seen it yet, but that does not mean its not possible i guess.

If its a problem to post ips - ok. I guess thats an argument people can or at least have to follow. I doubt the correlation of ip and nickname is too much of a problem for the german Datenschutzrichtlinien though. But since i have no legal degree i cannot tell.

And Zarel is right about closing threads. I dont blame people for doing that but it does not help to cool down which we all most likely will after some time.

What i am still asking for is a reason what send coyote over the edge. I mean its not so uncommon for players to call other players cheating. Maybe it wasnt done in the forums yet, but it would be nice for people hosting to have a (incomplete and inaccurate) list of cheaters /suspected cheaters still. At least in my opinion.
It is not knowledge, but the act of learning, not possession but the act of getting there, which grants the greatest enjoyment. - Carl Friedrich Gauss

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Re: Cheaters IPs.

Post by Zarel » 26 Sep 2010, 22:08

Germanium wrote:correct, but as some cheaters are able to kick people in the lobby (while not being the host themselves) - at least this was the case for 2.3.4 (dont know if that changed) - why should they not being able to kick people during the game? I agree - i have not seen it yet, but that does not mean its not possible i guess.
What Buggy is saying is that that bug was fixed in 2.3.5.

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