The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby HLG Dale » 07 May 2009, 20:03

lol, you could put the body sideway's for both turrets xD
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby whippersnapper » 07 May 2009, 23:26

.
Ha.. side-ways... good one. :)

It also reminds me of a cool GFX Weap Mod that Troman made a very long time ago.

Instead of your conventional turret he had an armature resembling a wing, that rotated like a turret, and there was
a weap on both armature tips... This was back in 2000. It was very cool. I don't think it was ever released
because it was for the ManGodAi Campaign.... plus Troman was as much a perfectionist with his Maps & Mods
as he was with his A.I.s and WZS (& WZCK which he turned over to Strata for continued dev.).

regards, whipper :)
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby ouch » 12 May 2009, 07:43

I vote the twin turrets stay for tanks, but only single turrets for vtol.

twin turrets add an incredible amount of additional strategy to the game which fits nicely into scope of the game.

Those who say "my gun is inside the other gun, oh no!" can just go play supreme commander. (where the ships like to drive inside one another btw...)

people know the game is being worked on and upgraded regularly, official releases really just mean it won't crash on you.
ouch
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby Buginator » 13 May 2009, 04:58

ouch wrote:I vote the twin turrets stay for tanks, but only single turrets for vtol.

twin turrets add an incredible amount of additional strategy to the game which fits nicely into scope of the game.

Those who say "my gun is inside the other gun, oh no!" can just go play supreme commander. (where the ships like to drive inside one another btw...)

people know the game is being worked on and upgraded regularly, official releases really just mean it won't crash on you.

Erm, no, official releases doesn't mean it won't crash on you...

I also think we shouldn't force something that can look like crap to everyone, it is a turn off, and also can result in more bug reports.
We are talking about people new to the game, and those that have played the game before, and then the die hard class...

We just need more man power to fix all the issues.

Everyone who wants them, then can you kindly help out, break out the pie editor / blender / text editor, and start fixing them? :3
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby alienkid10 » 13 May 2009, 20:54

why can't the second turret be higher up then the first? That would solve the clipping issues.
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby Buginator » 13 May 2009, 22:00

alienkid10 wrote:why can't the second turret be higher up then the first? That would solve the clipping issues.

Nobody said it couldn't. We just need people to fix the pie files.
There are allot of combinations to test....
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby Zarel » 13 May 2009, 22:08

Buginator wrote:Nobody said it couldn't. We just need people to fix the pie files.
There are allot of combinations to test....

And restrict the second turret to light weapons! That should fix a lot of the issues.
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby HLG Dale » 16 May 2009, 02:27

Zarel wrote:And restrict the second turret to light weapons! That should fix a lot of the issues.

that would be quite cool :cool: , having a meduim or heavy turret and then having an secoday light cannon :P
but it would be soo much better if they could fire at 2 diffrent targets ;), but before you say all that stuff i dont understand, i know that you would have to do something to the game to allow multiple fireing ant 2 diffrent targets, yada yada yada... :stare:
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby dant3 5tra5t » 15 Jul 2009, 23:31

dosnt the cyborg vtol transport have 2 turrets (2 machine guns 1 in front 1 in back) if so then maybe work off of that
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby whippersnapper » 16 Jul 2009, 00:22

.

The WORK to be done involves re-doing tons of .PIE art and testing a multitude of new combinations. (Reading comes in handy before posting ;) )

The troop transport you speak of was a mod first done in 2001 and does not really speak to what is involved here which is very simply -

WHO is gonna re-do all the .PIE art and test all the combos ????

Like much of what is proposed to advance WZ in one way or another there are a bazillion well documented ideas and HOW to do them - but
very few willing and able to DO IT.

Which is why folks to do stuff will always be needed more than anything to advance the game. And this last includes testing and useful feedback on stuff already DONE, which anyone can do but few take 5-minutes of time to do & thereby "pay it forward"... as fine a gesture as a "random act of kindness", methinks.)

Regards, whipper :cool:
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby dant3 5tra5t » 16 Jul 2009, 18:18

do you got a program that would allow me to do the pie art
It may take me a while but ill eventually figure some stuff out.
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby whippersnapper » 16 Jul 2009, 20:30

dant3 5tra5t wrote:do you got a program that would allow me to do the pie art
It may take me a while but ill eventually figure some stuff out.


WZ's very own GFX warhorse, "Pie Slicer DX", which you can get here: http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/stratadrake/utils/

There isn't a GFX modder who hasn't used it and there are many posting refs though-out the forums on matters related to it you can pull up in a BB search - and there are all the tutorials at Lav_Coyote's "WZ Document Project".

As far as "figuring-out"......

One thing I'm not sure is covered adequately is that "Pie Slicer DX" uses the WZ texture pages in .bmp format (& the original ..pcx .pie ref spec) while the game binary has been updated to use .png texture pages. Which means you have to make a simple modification to any .pie file generated by "Pie Slicer DX" to refer to the.png pages instead of .bmp (and .pcx spec ref) pages which takes just a sec by opening the .pie in a text editor like Word Pad and changing it like so.

Pie Slicer DX .PIE spec = TEXTURE 0 page-10-laboratories.pcx 256 256

Pie spec used by current game binary = TEXTURE 0 page-10-laboratories.png 256 256

The actual texture pages used by Pie Slicer DX are .bmp

So, for example, if there is a new texture .png page in the game base wz.you wanna work with in "Pie Slicer DX" then you make a copy of the .png
page, convert that to a .bmp and put the .bmp page in your Pie Slicer DX directory. After you finish with your generated .pie model you do as above to make the spec compatible with the game binary - that is open it in Word Pad and change the specref as per .pcx > .png explained above.

Other than that the extant Pie Slicer DX tutorials are pretty darn good in covering all you need to know and you can find 'em at Lav's WZ Doc Project.

Regards, whip :cool:
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby Buginator » 26 Jul 2009, 05:54

whippersnapper wrote:.
WHO is gonna re-do all the .PIE art and test all the combos ????

Like much of what is proposed to advance WZ in one way or another there are a bazillion well documented ideas and HOW to do them - but
very few willing and able to DO IT.

Regards, whipper :cool:
.

:3

Well said.
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby astorian » 29 Jul 2009, 14:38

Hello to all,
This topic taken my interest so badly i started to dig around the WZ files, created some pie files (turret+gun) and experimenting with them.
What i found out - there is maybe a solution for multiple turrets from a different perspective.
Imagine a normal assembled tank with body, propulsion and weapon (turret+gun). The second weapon (turret+gun) is below or above (even sideways) the main weapon that can turn around and up and down. But the secondary weapon can turn only up and down. That means the vehicle body turns to align the secondary weapon on z axis (the same principle as mortar), meanwhile the primary weapon can turn around and fire at anything around.
I have successfully tested a side attached primary weapon with only u/down movement.

Even if i think most of you don't like this idea, i would like to ask how can i test multi turrets ?.
Do i have to add one more connector to the body object or what should i do?
I didn't find a documentation how to test the twin/multi turret, so if someone has the link or can point me to the source i would appreciate it!

Best Regards,
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Re: The bad twin turrets for big bodies are inside again

Postby Per » 29 Jul 2009, 15:53

Most bodies already have additional connectors added. You can experiment with them by using Zarel's rebalance mod, I believe.
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