Help needed testing 3.2.x Campaign games!

[Bethrezen]

Used maps and incomplete missions interesting, maybe something to look at adding to the game later on, assuming its possible to gleen enough information from the game files to determine what pumpkins original intentions for those missions where before they decided to remove them.

I wonder why they would design missions but not include them in the game ?

[edit]

I've been keeping a list of general issues that I've encountered which you can find here.

https://forums.wz2100.net/viewtopic.php ... 43#p137443

I have another one to add to the list.

After you build 5 power stations, research stations and factories the modules for all 3 are not removed from the build list.

[-Philosopher-]

That is EnemyBase3 I'm looking at there, I presume?

Yep. I think there is another bunker to the north that this base owns.

I took another look. It wasn’t obvious in my initial screenshot, but I had got them all. It still seems to be dependent on killing the bunker to the south of the hill:

What would be the objective of the new thread? ...

I meant the finer details like group behavior/unit production and anything else that would go otherwise unnoticed.

OK. Behavioural differences, including production and building → new thread; bugs → here. Sound good?

I take it you inherited those behaviour differences (i.e. they’re not the outcome of any of your recent work, right)? While I think regressions should be avoided, I agree non-level-breaking differences such as those should be parked for the future (for what my opinion’s worth) so I’ll do as you suggest. Just let me know which are which as I go.

Speaking of wzcam, have you noticed any missing structures (or stuff we should be able to build) that we can not build anymore? Just want to make sure the research is granting everything properly.

No, and I have been keeping an eye out, although, as it wasn’t the objective of the exercise, I’ve only delved into a detailed comparison when investigating levels that played out differently in some obvious way. I guess it’s possible I’ve missed something on one of the levels that didn’t.

There are a couple of examples of the opposite, however. There’s the previously discussed composite alloys mk2/python body difference of course, and the other one I noticed is bombard emplacement. I haven’t delved into the “why” yet, but in wzcam bombard emplacement is only available from the start of the beta stages and you don’t specifically research it, whereas in jscam I was able to research it in Alpha 08 as part of the python body chain. I noticed there were a few techs like that in wzcam - i.e. aren’t researched but just become available at the start of certain stages. There’s the concrete sensor tower at the start of beta, and, similarly, assault gun bunker and flamer emplacement (not bunker - that’s another thing) at the start of the gamma stages IIRC (I’ll confirm these when I get to them in my more detailed pick-through).

Re. composite alloys mk2/python body, I think I’ve finally understood it was effectively a bug in wzcam, but I didn’t quite get how it would have behaved if the structure check had worked properly. Which structure and/or other tech were these dependent on, and where were they picked up? I never noticed picking them up so I assume they open up as a result of researching something else, but, of course, with the faulty structure check, you can’t see in the game what that was for certain. Is it composite alloys mk2 is simply dependent on composite alloys mk1 (acquired on Alpha 08), but the former, unlike the latter, is (was) dependent on having a (vehicle) factory present as well to research?

Download FlaME (map editor) ...

Ah… FlaME. I’ve been meaning to look into that for a while now. I guess now’s a good time! Thanks for the link.

[-Philosopher-]

Tested on Master 52db941 (19-Sep-2017)

Alpha 06

Despite being one of the more involved, this stage plays out pretty much the same in wzcam and jscam, so the conversion looks good in the main.

There are a number of issues with objective markers (red dots) and base definitions, however.

1. The objective marker for the initial objective - units attacking the SE - is missing in jscam. In wzcam it’s there from the beginning of the stage until you reach it with your units:


2. There’s something screwy going on with the base area for the SE Scav Base. Aren’t these bunkers part of the SE Scav Base? I should have “scavenger base detected” and a red dot by now (compare with wzcam):


Its red dot only appeared after I’d managed to destroy most of the base (I think it was when one of those northernmost defences came into view):


This doesn’t look right either - the “scavenger outpost has been eradicated”, but there are still defences to the north that would seem to logically be part of it. In wzcam, there’s one area (and associated red dot) for all of these defences:


Also strange, I’ve eradicated the scavenger outpost (I got the audio message and the walls blew up spontaneously), yet the red dot is still there:


In both wzcam and jscam the base ultimately clears up when the northern scav bunkers are destroyed, so at least it ends up the same:


In jscam, however, when I killed the two scav bunkers just to the north, I got another “outpost eradicated” message (the red dot disappeared with the second message). Two areas on top of each other?

3. The red dot for the second LZ has shown up too early - it should only be revealed after its related cutscene when it opens (it’s an LZ, not a base) much later in the game, and shouldn’t be discoverable before then:




4. It’s a minor thing, but (back to the LZs aren’t bases point) these walls didn’t spontaneously combust in wzcam, as this wasn’t considered a base:


Inconsistently here, not all of the walls blow up either:

In wzcam, the LZ closed when you killed the four turrets on its perimeter. You could shoot up the rest of the walls around it at your leisure later for the experience

5. The objective marker for the 2nd enemy LZ is missing after restoring a save made after the cutscene. Here are screenshots taken when making the save and after restoring it, respectively:

Here are the saves made before and after getting the cutscene (you’ll probably need the former to reproduce the issue):

Alpha 06 - 2nd enemy LZ.zip

(202.57 KiB) Downloaded 125 times

Testing on Master 3c907bd (19-Sep-2017)

6. I revisited the 2nd Enemy LZ. The LZ objective marker seems to not be appearing at all now (I picked up from a save made before the related cutscene). In the last of these four pics I haven’t reached the 2nd LZ yet - the remaining towers were revealed when I got closer but I forgot to get a screenshot for proof. The Scav component of the central plateau base seems to be working correctly now, however:


Alpha 07

The good news… in wzcam this level is clearly bugged (in my latest playthrough, I got one enemy transport, then the level ended, and I always used to have trouble with this level), whereas in jscam it seems to reliably work well (in all playthroughs I get multiple transports in various locations up until somewhere between the 5 and 10 min to go mark).

The bad news… the green dot seems to have broken again:

It never appeared at all through the stage, although the stage did complete successfully.

Alpha 08

The central red dot - visible from as soon as you land - marks the “designated area to be scouted” described in the video that introduces this stage. It should disappear when you reach it, but at the moment I think it is being conflated with the green dot marking LZ #2. Currently, the red dot only disappears when you get the 2nd cutscene, and the green dot is missing altogether:


Both should be present - to match what’s shown in the video.

The green dot marking the 2nd LZ should be just becoming visible at this point:

It should disappear after the cutscene and reinforcements are made available, then reappear when “return to LZ” becomes valid (when all three artefacts are recovered).

This is another stage where you could destroy everything and still not have the stage end (until you returned to the LZ) previously:

I’m not a fan of this change where it’s been made. Makes it easier to end levels accidentally before you intended to and otherwise feels unecessary to me.

Stage plays fine otherwise, however. Indeed, it’s actually slightly more challenging on jscam - unusually - due to differences in sensor mechanics between the two versions. The mortar units on the hill in the NW (and any that are manufactured in the base) are more effective as a result in 3.x

Alpha 09

Like Alpha 05, this used to be a stage where you had to destroy everything to finish. “Return to LZ” has been added to it in jscam.

… is my only comment. The only bug (?) I spotted is in both wzcam and jscam (the enemy LZ never acquires a red dot or gives other clues as to whether its active or not - do we want to add this so all LZs are consistent?), and they otherwise play out exactly the same.

Alpha 10

Little to report. With all relevant techs now researchable in earlier stages, there’s now even less to do than before

However, I did notice that transports are leaving it rather late to show a red dot in jscam compared to wzcam. In jscam, a red dot doesn’t show until a transport has already dropped its troops - the keen-eyed can see them on the map before the red dot appears. In wzcam, the red dot coincides with the second audio message, which is a little in advance of the transport landing. In wzcam, the red dot also stays in that location until the drop location changes or there is a period of time with no transports. In jscam, it’s gone before it’s off the map… so the red dots aren’t really doing anything in jscam. It’s the same in Alpha 07 too. Here’s a selection of screenshots that attempt to show the respective timings:


Here the ground invasion has started (the vehicle don't arrive in transports but come from off-map instead) but they don't get a red dot at all (but should):

The ground assault from the north is also similarly missing its red dot.

The drop patterns are also quite different between wzcam and jscam, but I assume that, like Alpha 07, that just represents a fix to an old bug. The jscam drop pattern is more involved and goes on for much longer and more drops (in more locations). Which all seems like an improvement to me.

[Berserk Cyborg]

I took another look. It wasn’t obvious in my initial screenshot, but I had got them all. It still seems to be dependent on killing the bunker to the south of the hill

Any chance you reloaded a save already from that mission? Most of the time a mission needs to be started anew for updates to be observed.

OK. Behavioural differences, including production and building → new thread; bugs → here. Sound good?

Sounds good to me.

I take it you inherited those behaviour differences (i.e. they’re not the outcome of any of your recent work, right)? While I think regressions should be avoided, I agree non-level-breaking differences such as those should be parked for the future (for what my opinion’s worth) so I’ll do as you suggest. Just let me know which are which as I go.

NoQ did everything up to Alpha 8 (exception is Alpha 3). I started with Alpha 9 and have been doing the rest of the campaign over the course of a year. To be fair, my conversions are not perfect either.
That and WZScripts the size of the campaign ones are rather hard to understand and very misleading as to what is going on.

Only about ten or so research items even used the "required structure" (alloys/cyborg tech). Even if it worked correctly, the research would be granted as it is now.

Alpha 6.
The blip does appear, you probably were too close to it at the beginning and it deactivated. Moved the removal trigger farther into the valley.

There’s something screwy going on with the base area for the SE Scav Base.

Very much correct. There are in fact two bases using almost the exact same cleanup area. No doubt that would lead to some "interesting" behavior (as you documented). So I fixed it to use only one base there.

Alpha 7 green objective only appears when the player needs to build a sufficient amount of structures. It may not look it, but the plateau is much larger than one would think (yes, those bunkers are in the plateau build area).

I will report back once I get farther into what you have documented.

EDIT:
Ok, Fixed the wall corner not in the cleanup for LZ 1 for Alpha 6, and recreated the blip behavior in Alpha 8. Transporter blips stay now (until the next one tries to comes back), again, instead of being removed when the transporter flies off.

EDIT 2:
Pushed master 87be78b21f3672f40c1bdd00c1f38fd96b77a771. I let the commit message speak for itself.

Any of you run across some lag or slowdowns? It is not noticeable on normal speeds, but 10x and up shows it. I assume it has to be with group tactics, though I have not looked much into this yet. I can confirm it happens regardless of regrouping, so that eliminates cluster analysis being the culprit.

[-Philosopher-]

I took another look. It wasn’t obvious in my initial screenshot, but I had got them all. It still seems to be dependent on killing the bunker to the south of the hill

Any chance you reloaded a save already from that mission? Most of the time a mission needs to be started anew for updates to be observed.

Er... yup. Mea culpa. Didn't know that's how they worked... but do now! I'll give that one another go, this time from the top.

Only about ten or so research items even used the "required structure" (alloys/cyborg tech). Even if it worked correctly, the research would be granted as it is now.

Yes, I understood that. I was trying to understand what the specific dependencies are/were i.e. what opens up Composite Alloys Mk2 to be able to be researched? My current theory is Composite Alloys Mk1 (obviously) + (vehicle, not cyborg) factory (if structure dependencies were enforced). Is that correct?

Don't suppose you know what the old dependencies for bombard emplacement were in wzcam, too? It didn't seem to be structure dependent in wzcam... but actually was it? It's now available 5 stages earlier in jscam - is that also to do with removing the "required structure" dependency?

Alpha 6.
The blip does appear, you probably were too close to it at the beginning and it deactivated. Moved the removal trigger farther into the valley.

Do you mean the initial one, in the SE, at the start of the stage, that's referenced in the video sequence at the beginning as where NP is attacking from? Yes, you're right. When I reloaded various saves, the red dot was there fine. I also couldn't replicate it disappearing too soon - the only mobile units I had south of my base were a pair of trucks that get recalled north immediately, but travel too far west to affect it. When I sent them due east into the valley, the red dot turned off exactly where I would have expected it to - even in the version before your latest update. I don't know why I saw what I captured in the screenshot. Apologies for crying wolf on that one.

There’s something screwy going on with the base area for the SE Scav Base.

Very much correct. There are in fact two bases using almost the exact same cleanup area. No doubt that would lead to some "interesting" behavior (as you documented). So I fixed it to use only one base there.

Will check back on this after I update to the latest master (and will run the stage from the top )

Alpha 7 green objective only appears when the player needs to build a sufficient amount of structures. It may not look it, but the plateau is much larger than one would think (yes, those bunkers are in the plateau build area).

Ah, so turret structures, by themselves, are sufficient? I thought base structures (factories, power plants, etc.) were required. Certainly seems to be the case in wzcam (I built the exact same things in each version in order to compare how it worked). Have the criteria changed in jscam?

Anyway, I'll try that one again with the area around there completely empty this time.

EDIT:
Ok, Fixed the wall corner not in the cleanup for LZ 1 for Alpha 6, and recreated the blip behavior in Alpha 8. Transporter blips stay now (until the next one tries to comes back), again, instead of being removed when the transporter flies off.

Are you treating LZs as bases in jscam? In wzcam, they're quite clearly not and demonstrate quite a few subtle differences in behaviour - most noticeable of which is they don't "clean up" (walls explode spontaneously) when they close, and there are different audio messages of course.

Re. the transport blips, have you looked into the timing of when they switch on for each transport? They seemed a lot slower to appear in jscam than wzcam (to the extent I'd be seeing red blips on the structures they were attacking before I saw the blip for the transporter in jscam). In wzcam they seemed to come on as the associated transporter slowed down to a hover before descending to drop their contents.

EDIT 2:
Pushed master 87be78b21f3672f40c1bdd00c1f38fd96b77a771. I let the commit message speak for itself.

Updating now

Any of you run across some lag or slowdowns? It is not noticeable on normal speeds, but 10x and up shows it. I assume it has to be with group tactics, though I have not looked much into this yet. I can confirm it happens regardless of regrouping, so that eliminates cluster analysis being the culprit.

Nothing obvious, despite the low-powered machine I'm doing all this on. Indeed the only (performance related) thing I've noticed is the 2.3.8 version I've been testing runs much more smoothly than the various masters I've been testing, but didn't read anything into it - could be a feature of all the 3.x versions. It also wasn't significant enough for me to spend time looking into - it's only noticeable in the comparison and otherwise doesn't impinge on the gameplay.

[Bethrezen]

Re. composite alloys mk2/python body, I think I’ve finally understood it was effectively a bug in wzcam, but I didn’t quite get how it would have behaved if the structure check had worked properly. Which structure and/or other tech were these dependent on, and where were they picked up? I never noticed picking them up so I assume they open up as a result of researching something else, but, of course, with the faulty structure check, you can’t see in the game what that was for certain. Is it composite alloys mk2 is simply dependent on composite alloys mk1 (acquired on Alpha 08), but the former, unlike the latter, is (was) dependent on having a (vehicle) factory present as well to research?

Only about ten or so research items even used the "required structure" (alloys/cyborg tech). Even if it worked correctly, the research would be granted as it is now.

Yes, I understood that. I was trying to understand what the specific dependencies are/were i.e. what opens up Composite Alloys Mk2 to be able to be researched? My current theory is Composite Alloys Mk1 (obviously) + (vehicle, not cyborg) factory (if structure dependencies were enforced). Is that correct?

Don't suppose you know what the old dependencies for bombard emplacement were in wzcam, too? It didn't seem to be structure dependent in wzcam... but actually was it? It's now available 5 stages earlier in jscam - is that also to do with removing the "required structure" dependency?

Your best bet is to check the warzone tech tree to answer questions like that here this should help

Full Tech tree
https://betaguide.wz2100.net/Research.php?tree=1

Research Path to component: Heavy Body - Python
https://betaguide.wz2100.net/Research.p ... cle-Body11

Research Path to component: Bombard Pit
https://betaguide.wz2100.net/Research.p ... nse-HvyMor

now as for where in the game you would get these, I know that you always got the composite alloy artefact on alpha 08 even in the original game although to be absolute certain i'd need to check that against the 1.10 version however in the past getting at composite alloy mk2 and the python body was a bit hit and miss due to game bugs.

Sometimes i would get composite alloy mk2 and the python body on alpha 08, sometimes i would get them at the start of alpha 09 and other times i wouldn't be able to research them till i took off for alpha 09 and was on the alpha 09 away map.

Having said that judging from the tech tree i believe that the correct implementation for when you are supposed to get access to composite alloy mk2 and the python body is how it is now, aka on alpha 08 after researching the composite alloy mk1, and if the required structure check had worked correctly in the original game then i believe that you would always of gotten composite alloy mk2 and the python body on alpha 08.

As for the bombard pit I'm not sure i would need to check the old 1.10 version to be sure, but again judging from the tech tree i believe that the current implementation is correct since you pick up the bombard mortar on alpha 08 and therefore should be able to research the bombard pit after researching the bombard mortar.

Alpha 7 green objective only appears when the player needs to build a sufficient amount of structures. It may not look it, but the plateau is much larger than one would think (yes, those bunkers are in the plateau build area).

Ah, so turret structures, by themselves, are sufficient? I thought base structures (factories, power plants, etc.) were required. Certainly seems to be the case in wzcam (I built the exact same things in each version in order to compare how it worked). Have the criteria changed in jscam?

Anyway, I'll try that one again with the area around there completely empty this time.

That's going to be tough to compare because Alpha 07 was always a buggy mission, and i always had issues when i got to Alpha 07 its why i always built at least 1 factory a few turrets and a repair bay just to make sure i covered my bases because it was never clear on the older versions what the victory conditions for Alpha 07 where, and sometimes despite the fact that i built that and killed all the drop ships full of troops the level would still refuse to end.

although the victory condition now i believe is much simpler and only requires you to build 4 structure of any type.

[-Philosopher-]

I took another look. It wasn’t obvious in my initial screenshot, but I had got them all. It still seems to be dependent on killing the bunker to the south of the hill

Any chance you reloaded a save already from that mission? Most of the time a mission needs to be started anew for updates to be observed.

Er... yup. Mea culpa. Didn't know that's how they worked... but do now! I'll give that one another go, this time from the top.

Can confirm this is good now

[alfred007]

I updated to master 87be78 and downloaded the alpha 12 save from bethrezen too have a look at. Playing still goes on but what I can say now is that the NP LZ doesn't work. The game started with 41 minutes left on the timer, I'm now at 26 minutes left and no transport came in. When I'm finished I upload saved games and logs.

[Bethrezen]

I updated to master 87be78 and downloaded the alpha 12 save from bethrezen too have a look at. Playing still goes on but what I can say now is that the NP LZ doesn't work. The game started with 41 minutes left on the timer, I'm now at 26 minutes left and no transport came in. When I'm finished I upload saved games and logs.

are you sure you actually triggered the drop zone ?

The reason I ask is because i believe that the trigger point for the drop zone is just north of where you collect the hover artefact and i never went anywhere near that area in the save i uploaded, having said that this is difficult to confirm because when you switch on debug mode on alpha 12 it doesn't give you the red halo effect to indicate the different trigger zones like it does on previous levels, so that's probably something else that needs looking at.

In any event I'll update to the latest master and double check that, and then I'll see if i can figure out what is causing the enemy units to glitch like that, because at the moment I'm unsure whether this is a reload issue or not.

[alfred007]

are you sure you actually triggered the drop zone ?

Yes I did. I destroyed the base with the hover artifact and moved with your half-tracked units north. And I finished succesfull the level and the whole time no transports were coming in.

[-Philosopher-]

Alpha 06 on 87be78b

There’s something screwy going on with the base area for the SE Scav Base.

Very much correct. There are in fact two bases using almost the exact same cleanup area. No doubt that would lead to some "interesting" behavior (as you documented). So I fixed it to use only one base there.

Will check back on this after I update to the latest master (and will run the stage from the top )

Which I've now done - and it looks good. SE scav base is both detected and eradicated where/when I expect it to be.

The objective marker for the NP frontline defences just north of those seems to have disappeared now though (possibly the "base discovered" message too - although they're easy to miss. "base eradicated" message was fine):


It used to look like this in jscam and wzcam respectively:


Also, I don't think you've got to it yet, but the LZ south of the central plateau base is still discoverable too early. I'm wondering if that might be the most practical issue of treating them like a base? Unlike a base, they have no significance until they open, and thus until that point, there shouldn't be any red dots to discover. In this specific example, it gives away the presence of something to worry about too early in the stage:

I'm speculating though - could be there's no distinction in the implementation and this is just a bug.

[Bethrezen]

Yes I did. I destroyed the base with the hover artifact and moved with your half-tracked units north. And I finished succesfull the level and the whole time no transports were coming in.

Ok so just updated to master
warzone2100-master-20170923-043653-87be78b.exe (23-Sep-2017)

Tried loading the alpha 12 save that I uploaded previously and got errors here is the log

Code: Select all

 --- Starting log [C:\Documents and Settings\<user name>\Desktop\Warzone 2100_portable-master\Warzone 2100 master\logs\WZlog-0923_140158.txt]---
error   |02:02:54: [callFunction:209] 0 : camDetectEnemyBase(blabel = 'NPLZGroup') at script/campaign/libcampaign.js:904
error   |02:02:54: [callFunction:209] 1 : <anonymous>([object Object]) at script/campaign/cam1-d.js:33
error   |02:02:54: [callFunction:209] 2 : <anonymous>(droid = [object Object]) at script/campaign/libcampaign.js:2892
error   |02:02:54: [callFunction:209] 3 : <anonymous>([object Object]) at script/campaign/libcampaign.js:2922
error   |02:02:54: [callFunction:209] 4 : <global>() at -1
info    |02:02:54: [callFunction:212] Uncaught exception calling function "eventAreacauseWayTrig" at line 904: TypeError: Result of expression 'bi' [undefined] is not an object.
info    |02:02:54: [callFunction:212] Assert in Warzone: qtscript.cpp:212 (false), last script event: '<none>' 

Now figuring that these errors where a result of the changes braking existing saves I loaded up my end of level save for Alpha 11 and then proceeded on to Alpha 12 again, to make life a little easier I put on the biffer baker cheat and the deity cheat and then proceeded towards the enemy base and as you can see in this screen shot



The enemy transports showed up just as it should so if think your problem with no transports may well be a result of using an existing save.

With regards to what is causing the enemy units to bug as per my previous save that's what I'm going to investigate next, now currently i have 2 theories the first is that it is a reload issue, the second is its something to do with me destroying there sensor towers, however i wont know which till i test both possibilities.

[-Philosopher-]

Alpha 08 on 87be78b

-cam1-4a: Emulate some blip removal and appearance behavior.

This seems to work well now, but something has gone wrong with the NE Scav base - it isn't clearing up now:

... at least not visually. The level otherwise completed fine, however.

[Bethrezen]

@Philosopher
If you are looking to do a comparison between how Warzone was and how it is now.

Go here : http://warzone2100.pro/wzfile/wz_files/ ... ne2100_cd/

Download the 4 files these are disk images of the original disks.

Next download a trial copy of Ultra ISO : http://www.ezbsystems.com/ultraiso/

You can use this to open the images, either you can mount the images and run the installer or you can have Ultra ISO extract the contents of the images and then run the installer, once the game is installed patch it to v1.10 the last patch released by pumpkin.

The patch is here : warzone2100 v1.10 patch

Next copy the crack to the game directory and run it, the crack will remove the CD check so that you can run the game without the disk, you can delete the crack afterwards.

The crack is here : warzone 2100 v1.10 No CD Crack

The final step is to make sure that you copy the sequences folder from both disk 1 and 2 into the games main directory to make sure that video works correctly without the CD as well.

Once done you should have a fully functional copy of the original Warzone game as released by pumpkin studios to compare against.

I've just finished doing this my self so that i have something to refer back to. Credit goes to Terminator for pointing me in the right direction.

[alfred007]

The enemy transports showed up just as it should so if think your problem with no transports may well be a result of using an existing save

You are right, I reactivated an old alpha 11 save and the transporter comes in.